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There is a place that for my little girls is magic. It doesn't look any different than any other room in our church building most Sundays, but in that room, they have playtime and snack time, and then they are reminded of someone who loves them so much, someone who I like to think they still remember, their heavenly Father.

This magical place is their nursery class. And to be honest, thanks to the efforts of their exceptional nursery leaders, this room has become magic for me as well. Originally from New Zealand, Angie Robertshaw came to the United States 28 years ago after joining the church. She and her husband, Mark, are the parents of two children and grandparents to four grandchildren.

When I asked her how she would describe herself in a bio, she said, "Wife, mom, nana, covenant keeper." And I can't think of any way I'd rather be described.

This is All In, an LDS Living podcast where we ask the question: What does it really mean to be all in the gospel of Jesus Christ? I'm Morgan Pearson, and I am honored to have my friend, Angie Robertshaw, on the line with me today. Angie, welcome. Thank you. Thank you. It's good to be here. Well, I didn't... I don't think I told you this, Angie, but you actually were requested on this show because I posted some pictures-

of the Christmas program that you- Oh ... did in nursery on my Instagram, and some people said, "You need to have that nursery leader on All In." And I was like, "You know what? That is actually a very good idea." And I just am so excited for people to have the chance to, to learn from you. But I wanna start out, you were born in New Zealand and, um, I wondered, has your family always been in the church, or when did the gospel come into your life, Angie?

Okay. So I, yeah, I was born in New Zealand in a small, uh, coastal town in the north island of New Zealand. We're 15 children, so eight brothers, and I have six sisters, and I'm number 12. I am actually the only member of the church, Morgan, and I was introduced to the church through a college friend. I was at teachers college.

I was planning to be a elementary school teacher. And a friend of mine, she introduced me to the church and the missionaries. And I was almost 22, but I knew that baptism was what I needed to do, and I've not ever regretted it. And I just, just love the church. I just love it. Well, it's very clear that you do.

If you could share, when your friend in college introduced you to the gospel, what, w- what do you think it was that drew you to the- What she was sharing with you Okay. It was totally her example. I mean, she was always happy. Her name is Marnie, and she was a new convert, and her and her two brothers, the three of them joined the church.

And she just said to me one day... Uh, well, I said to her first, "You know, why are you always so happy?" You know, it was kind of annoying 'cause she was always so happy. But I knew that there was... I needed that, and she said, "It's because of my belief in the Church of Jesus Christ, you know? And would you like to meet the missionaries?"

And I said, "No, I'm, I'm quite happy how I am." You know, I had my plans all laid out. I'd finished teacher's college, travel, then go back to my hometown and teach there. But she just kept... You know, she was always just full of joy. She just had it all over her face. And so eventually she asked me again, and I said yes.

And then I was introduced to the missionaries. We went out to the, uh, visitor center at the Hamilton New Zealand temple, and I went through the tour. Back then they had couple missionaries who gave the tours. You know, now they have sister missionaries. But back then there was a sweet little old couple from Utah, and they took me through, and it was so interesting, Morgan.

They had the Book of Mormon pictures up. And every picture I kept thinking to myself, "Oh, I've heard that name before," you know, b- that Book of Mormon name. "I've heard that story before somewhere." I didn't know where. And then we ended up with, uh, um, at the end with, um, they told me about the first vision with Joseph Smith, and then I knew it was all true.

I just knew it, and then I said to the missionaries, "Okay, I'm, I'll take the discussions." And then we went from there. And like I said, I have not regretted it, not one bit. And at first I was a little bit worried that my parents would be a little bit... You know, they belong to the Ratana Church, which is a Maori-based church.

They have their own prophet, TW Ratana. So they, they attended that church and, and I did, too, uh, through my, you know, growing up years. So I was a little bit worried 'cause my friend Marnie, her parents disowned her and her brothers when they joined the church. And I was a little bit worried, but, you know, it worked out well.

It worked out okay because just so happened my p- eldest brother-in-law, his family were members of the church. And so we had some little interaction with, you know, back then we just called them Mormons, you know, the Mormon church back then. So my parents knew that they were good people, my brother-in-law's side of the family, and so they all, all of my, my whole family just were, just accepted it after that.

And then when they m- you know, I told them I was gonna come Over to the US and marry my husband, someone they'd never met before, who was also, you know, a, a member of the church. I had met him as a missionary. They were a bit, you know, a bit concerned. But in the end, when we moved back to New Zealand and they met Mark, got to know him, got to love him, they...

And like I said, they're our biggest supporters. So, um, I'm very grateful for that. Grateful. That's awesome. I wanna back up a little bit, though. I, I know you told me before how many kids were in your family. Mm-hmm. And you also told me that you had kind of an untraditional upbringing- Yes ... and that that was kind of normal at the time in New Zealand.

Can you tell me a little bit- Mm ... about that? So I'm of, um, Maori descent. I also have, uh, Scottish and Irish in my heritage. And it's very common in New Zealand, especially among the Maori people, to be brought up by other members or extended members of the family. So because there were so many children, my parents, my, um...

I was brought up by my uncle and my auntie. They became my legal guardians. Also an older brother, an older sister, and a younger brother. So there were four of us. And we kind of just played musical houses, so we could gravitate between the two homes. Yeah, and, uh, I always found... I actually have always felt special that I was a part of a big, huge family.

We all love each other. All my siblings are still, you know, living. My parents have passed on. Yeah, and I just... I don't know. I just grew up like that. It was kind of common. Well, and I think that that's so, it's so interesting to me to hear you say like, "I always felt special," because I think it would be really easy in a situation like that to feel slighted, but you didn't feel that way?

Mm-mm. No. Wow. 'Cause we were all... I don't know. We just grew up with a lot of love and a lot of respect. Our par- our parents were always supportive of what we did, whether it was schooling or s- uh, sports. All my brothers went to a boys' boarding school up in Auckland, and us girls stayed home and went to local schools.

But yeah, I always felt special to be a part of such a big family, you know, dynamic. It worked for us. So cool. I wanted to ask you, do you make it back to New Zealand very often, Angie? Um, I've only... Okay, so we, my husband and I, my husband was the missionary who baptized me. And so after his mission, a year later, um, we got- Sealed in the, uh, Jordan River Temple.

And, um, so we lived here for a time here in Utah, and our daughter was born in 1990, and then we decided we needed to go home and do family history. You know, my side of the family, my Harawira side. So we just sewed up what, everything we had, and we moved back to New Zealand. We lived there for about six and a half years.

My son was born there in '95. And then we just felt really strongly Heavenly Father wanted us to raise them back here, so we moved back to Utah, um, in '97. So we've been here ever since, and I've only been home once. And that's really just, um, because we just can't afford it. It's that kind of thing, a economic thing.

However, like you mentioned, um, in a earlier conversation, we're so grateful for technology, so I can talk to my sisters, my brothers whenever I want to. You know, just FaceTime. I can just text them whenever I want to, so I feel connected to them that way. And my siblings, my nieces and nephews and everybody like that, they're all actually very supportive of the church because of when we lived back there.

They're actually very sweet about it. You know, they wouldn't offer us tea or coffee, you know, and they wouldn't smoke near us or drink or offer us drinks or anything like that. And if anybody said anything about the church, our church, then they would stick up for, for Mark and I, you know, and say, "Hey, you know, my sister's a Mormon," you know?

That kind of thing. So yeah, it was, it was just great. I- I'm- I'm very blessed. I'm very blessed to have support, you know? And, and Angie, the church is fairly strong in New Zealand- Mm ... right? It's growing. Yes, it's growing. When I was back there, you know, it was, uh, I think we were, like, third, the third-biggest, and I don't know what it is right now.

But, um, yeah, there are so many, uh, strong Latter-Day Saints back there. It's awesome. That's neat. And now we have, you know, we have the, uh, Hamilton Temple, the Auckland Temple, and then they're building the one in Wellington. So we've got... That's a huge, huge thing for our country. Yeah. And how would you say, Angie, that now being in the US and having raised your kids here, how does your culture and, and your n- upbringing in New Zealand, how does that culture continue to influence your life?

Okay, so I would say that The Maori people, Polynesians, Pacific Islanders have, we all have a belief that there is one God. You know? So, um, I've always grown up knowing, okay, there's a God, there's Jesus Christ. I've always had prayers at night, you know, just by myself. Um, my auntie who raised me, she was Jehovah Witness.

And so it was kind of like, it was kind of interesting growing up with my auntie, but she never, ever, you know, tried to influence me or anybody else in my family. But we, I believe the, the Maori people are very strong in, in spiritual matters and gospel matters. So I've always just kind of believed, you know, I've just always believed that there is a God.

And my culture is very, very important to me. I'm not fluent in Te Reo, in the language, but I can understand it, and all my siblings are. And so yeah, it didn't... I can still have my culture and it doesn't, it doesn't take away from the gospel learning that I have to, you know, grow and to know. Well, I wanna shift a little bit.

I, Angie, have had the chance to sit in... So I sh- probably should tell people that our nursery in our ward right now consists of three children, two of the three of whom are mine. And so nursery matters a little bit more to me than to most, probably. But I've had the chance to sit in nursery, and I've told people, I told somebody today, I was like, when, when Angie or one of the other sisters that serves in the nursery, when they talk to my kids and they say, "You know, Emma, Heavenly Father loves you so much," I'm like, "I believe it."

And, and, uh, my friend who I was telling that to today, she said, "You're, you're kinda like, 'Can you say that to me too?'" Um, but it's true. And, and I, I think that it's so beautiful the way you and the other two sisters who serve in our nursery approach it. And so I really wanted to pick your brain. And I wanted to start out, you, you told me that you feel like nursery is, in quotes, "your thing."

Did you always feel that way, or what led you to, to kind of that conclusion? It's probably experience, 'cause most of my church life has been in primary. And so I've always kept in my mind, you know, that, well, we're all children of God, and these particular, uh, spirits, these children who have come to Earth, the little ones in our nursery, they, they're so open to the Spirit, you know?

And we don't have to basic things down for them in the lessons or anything like that because they can feel the Spirit just like we can as adults. So we treat them as the Lord's little ones, that they're... And we tell-- teach them of Christ by the Spirit. We tell them how much they are loved by their Heavenly Father, by Jesus Christ, by their families, by us as their nursery leaders.

We try to create a safe and loving environment in our nursery. For us, the nursery is a sacred space and where we invite the Spirit to be with us. And in fact, I feel like in the church meeting houses, wherever the children are, it's a sacred space. And so I always approach it, approach it that way. Nursery is my thing because, um, I've just been so blessed by those I have served with and are serving with now and the children themselves.

And sometimes we'll have two children. Maybe once we had one child on a Sunday, and once, this year we had zero. Nobody was in town at that time, so we just had a little nursery leadership meeting, planned out our schedule, the rest of the letters, uh, lessons and so forth. But right now, this is where Heavenly Father has called me to be, so I'm, I'm just...

I just give it my all. And I'm so grateful for Janess and Michelle, who I serve with, because they also have the same mindset. They all know. They all have a testimony of Jesus Christ, and that we have been called at this time, at this season to be with these little ones, and they're worth it. So whatever we do, any advanced preparation for the lessons or a special lesson like Christmas or Easter or so forth, well, we're gonna give it Everything, you know, we're gonna give it our all 'cause they're-- they deserve it.

Well, I wanna talk a little bit about those special things that you've done on Easter and Christmas and Pioneer Day. You obviously put a lot of thought and preparation into those things, and I'd love for you to share kind of the way that you've approached those things, your planning, and give just people kind of an idea of why those days are special and how you kind of have made them special in nursery.

Okay. We'll, we'll go with the example of Christmas. Okay, so we have a Christmas lesson in the manual, and the manual is, uh, allows us to break up lessons into two parts if we want or repeat them, you know, week by week if we want. And, um, we're, uh, able to use church resources appro-- church-approved resources.

So for the Christmas lesson, we expand it. This past Christmas, I wrote a little inter-interactive musical play using all these resources and the Friend magazine, you know, articles and so forth. And we had the children move from room to room, and our theme was Follow the Star. And so we dressed... Us nursery leaders, we dressed up, you know, just basic costume and we had props around the room, uh, to go with the nativity story, and we lit-- followed the star all the way from, um, the beginning through to the manger where Jesus lay.

So it was, uh, it's just awesome. We, we enjoy it. We did the same just this year for the first time with Easter. Wrote a little interactive musical play and the children... 'cause it's very important for the children to be engaged in a lesson, not just s- you know, sitting and l- and showing a picture and so forth.

They need to be a part of it, and they need to feel the spirit and, um, and sing and, and have movement and, you know, and be active. 'Cause it's such a young age group, eighteen months up to three. So, and we have to keep it, you know, concise because their attention spans. Um, but that's when we rely on the Spirit to help us discern and, you know, decide how to move things along.

If we see the kids a little squirrely, then we move on to something different. But it's always done with love and with the Spirit, you know, guiding us. So we did the same thing with Easter. We just, you know, wore basic costumes, props, and did a little Snack time thing, and I, it's kind of hard to explain.

But, um, yeah, I just f- that's, that's just what we've been doing for those special lessons in the manual, Easter and Christmas. And sometimes, uh, we'll probably do a priesthood something sometime, and invite the Bishop Brick in or something. But, um yeah, we, it just works for us. It just works for us. For the Christmas one we just did, Follow the Star.

The year before we did A Journey to Bethlehem. It was a diff- a whole different thing. And we invited the Sunbeams and the s- four-year-olds to come too and join in with us last, this past year. It worked out really well. We're so fortunate in our ward that we have such good support, you know, from our primary presidencies, um, our state primary president.

She's come a few times. She's in our ward. We have the support of our Bishop Brick and the parents. The parents over the years that I've been in nursery in this ward have been amazing. Amazing. Well, I will tell you, Easter in particular this year, I got to the Easter program. As you went through the program, I was so grateful because I had been pregnant and sick.

And all these things, like I had seen... I'm gonna get emotional. I had seen in the Friend the thing about doing the rock garden with the tomb, and I thought, "That would be so fun to do with my girls," but I had been so sick that I just didn't feel up to doing it. Oh. And then, so we did that in nursery. And then you did the, the Last Supper kind of with the snack time, and I had thought about doing something special like that, but it had not happened at our house.

And then you had the palm leaves. And again, that was another thing that I had thought- ... if I had thought ahead, I would have ordered some palm leaves. And I was like, "Angie is doing everything that I wished that I had done at home." And just, like, as a mom, it meant so much to me that my kids were not missing out by my shortcoming, and instead were getting that in nursery.

And obviously, that isn't always the case. Angie, can you share, 'cause I haven't been there for the Pioneer Day. You do something special for Pioneer Day, too, is that right? Yes. Similar, we prep the room with okay, uh, uh, you, you have to kind of be there or- Okay ... see pictures, but I have pictures. And, um, we have, uh, we dress up in pioneer costumes as leaders.

We have bonnets and aprons and cowboy hats for the bo- for the children. They have an option of wearing a costume too, and we have our schedule for the... every Sunday, 'cause we only have 50 minutes with our children, so we wanna make every minute count. So we have, uh, our schedule is we have some playtime.

We put in activities during that playtime, uh, whether it's costumes, whatever, uh, games, uh, pioneer games, things like that. Then we have a pioneer snack. We usually do the, the butter, the butter in a jar. Uh-huh. And so we give the kids a chance to shake the butter, you know, shake the cream, the heavy cream to make butter that we put on our crackers for snack time.

You know, we kind of like try and incorporate pioneer things into that. And then both, um, Janess and Michelle have ancestry, uh, pioneer ancestry, so they share a little his- his, you know, part of their family history story as part of our lesson. And then we sing pioneer songs and... or, or their favorite songs.

It doesn't just have to be If I Said. We have a little... we'll sit around a makeshift, uh, fire, campfire and tell stories and have our snack. Yeah, it's quite a... I- I- It might seem like over the top, but we, we keep everything church approved, in the guidelines. It's not a daycare type thing. It's not a school thing, 'cause this is their church class.

This is their s- you know, their special church class. It's not a daycare. It's not a babysitting. It's a special time for us to be with the little ones. We just talk about the pioneer, the strength of the pioneers and things like that and It's- I love it ... I don't know, it's just what's said. I, I love it. Well, and I think-

I think you're spot on. I think it's so easy to think, "Oh, well, they just need to be entertained while their parents are in Relief Society." And the fact that you put so much thought, you and Michelle and Janess put so much thought into making sure that they are learning something- Mm-hmm ... because, like you said, they're capable.

Like, I'm blown away- Oh, absolutely ... by how smart they are. They are, and they know those big words, you know, 'cause we repeat them over and over, whether it's a big word like resurrection or the sacrament or, you know, priesthood blessings or the temples and things like that. It's all ... We make sure it's all incorporated in our lessons, in music, and just being together, 'cause repetition is very important so, um, for our learning, you know?

And we're really just, um, reinforcing what our children are getting at home, 'cause they're so bright. I mean, your children and, and Danny, you know, they just, they ... You can just see their minds working out. Like, "I've heard that story before," and, "I know that picture. That's Jesus," you know, and so forth, so. Well, I think- Yeah

it's neat to think that we, like, work in tandem a little bit- Mm-hmm ... and that those things, like I always sometimes am amazed by what my kids know, but I know it's not just me. Actually, today Emma told me that she was gonna go in the bushes behind our house, and she said- Uh-huh ... "Uh, the bushes are Gethsemane."

Oh. And she goes, "Is it okay if I go with Jesus in there?" Mm-hmm. And I said, "Jesus is in the bushes?" And she said, "Pretend Jesus." Mm-hmm. Um, so anyway, I just think it's, it's neat to see. I wanted to ask you though, Angie, I feel like one thing that would be hard for me is to feel like I've put so much effort and thought into something, and I watch the way my kids are sometimes, and I'm like-

"Guys, Angie has put so much work into this. Like, listen." But they're 18 months old, you know? And so, uh, how do you keep from getting discouraged, and why do you continue to put so much effort into something for little ones with such small attention spans? Okay. I've thought about this question, and to be honest, I don't get frustrated.

I don't feel like I'm putting a lot of effort in for little c- comeback. I am very blessed to- Know that Heavenly Father has so much confidence in me that he extended the calling to me. So I use that, I channel that. Everything I do in... And I would say the same for my fellow nursery leaders, Janiece and Michelle.

Everything we do for the children is because we love our Savior and we love our Heavenly Father. And, um, at this time, he- they want us, you know, here with, with the children in nursery. And so whatever effort we give is accepted. It's enough. I love it. I, I don't feel, you know, even if we only have one child, it's, it's that whole...

What's that scripture? Oh, the whole- Wherefore as we are gathered Oh, yeah ... in my name, there am I, there I am in the midst, you know? So it, it, whether it's for one child, two, three, or 10, they're going to get the same effort and love from us as, um, if there was just one child, you know? Um, so nursery for me, uh, uh, from experience because I've been in nursery quite a few times over the years, and so I've learnt a lot from other, um, other leaders.

And a lot of it is, is the spirit of discernment, you know, of what part of a lesson, for example, to share, what song to sing, how to, to have... help the children feel the spirit. You know, what part of something in the lesson to help them, you know, click. I got that, that light bulb moment. So yeah, for me, it's just, it's just a blessing, and I'm very, very grateful for any calling actually.

Any calling in the church is, is a blessing if you have that love in your heart. Well, and I actually, I'm, I'm glad you said that because I wanted to ask you that. I think that the ability to consecrate oneself- Mm-hmm ... in a calling is, I don't wanna say rare, because there are many people that, that put their whole heart into a calling.

Mm-hmm. But I will say that I have rarely, in my 36 years of church membership, seen someone who puts so much of themselves into a calling, and I do think that that is such a beautiful offering. So especially as a convert to the church who's come into the church seeing the way that people serve in callings, what do you think it is that makes you want to consecrate yourself in a calling, and why are callings a blessing?

Hmm. Big question. Take your time. I didn't prepare you for this one. Big question. I just feel that I was, I, you know... Okay, psst, let's back up a teeny bit. Yes, ma'am. The Māori people do not like show-offs. Okay? So we are very humble about blessings that we've been given or talents or so forth. We just don't show off.

We just, you know, it's just a no-no. So it's very difficult to talk about myself. With regards to your question and callings, I've just always been that way. I've just always been in tune with the Spirit, and I just accept that the Lord has blessed me with this understanding and love for children. And a calling allows me to, you know, magnify myself and, and, uh, as, as a nursery leader, magnify the calling, I should say.

Right. And it's all part of building up the kingdom of God. You know, I'm willing to do whatever I'm asked to build up the kingdom of God, and all the glory is to him. So I don't take the credit for myself. I always share it with my nursery leaders. We always tell the parents how amazing their child is, and because they deserve credit, too.

Yeah. And let me ask you one last question before we get to the last question. Okay. How would you say that service in the church, whether in this calling or other callings, has blessed your life? Oh, okay. So I, because I'm a convert, I joined the church when I was nearly 22, I didn't have the benefit of nursery, Primary, the youth program, seminary, things like that.

So, uh, my very first calling was to be a Primary teacher, and the children actually taught me the gospel because, you know, they knew a lot more than I did. And so that really blessed me. It really ha- has helped me with my understanding and knowledge of this wonderful gospel and eternity and my Savior, you know.

It's given me a lot more- Peace. Uh, my very dear friend Gina, she visited me recently, and she and I can talk about anything and everything, no judgment. We just, you know, do-do-do-do-do. Talk, talk, talk. And but it's always, uh, when we get together, I, we, it's always a great opportunity for me to self, self-review, self-reflect on my standing in the eyes of God.

And I, I said to her, "You know, I, at this time, at this particular time, I feel really at peace." 'Cause we had actually been talking about nursery, 'cause she was, um, a nursery w- leader with me at one point, and we talked about some of the fun things we did back then. And I've, I just said, "I feel at peace. I, I feel blessed that Heavenly Father, you know, believes in me enough to, to give me, you know, invite me to be a nursery leader, give me this invitation."

I accepted it. I committed myself to it. And I just do not know where I would be without the gospel of Jesus Christ in my life. You know, I'm so grateful for it. Well, I am so grateful for you, Angie, and I hope that you know that. I... Those little girls are, like, my whole world, you know? And to be able to send them each Sunday and to watch the way that, to watch the way that they dart to nursery as fast as they can-

and cannot get there fast enough. And as a mom, that means everything. Thank you. And so thank you. My last question for you is what does it mean to you to be all-in the gospel of Jesus Christ?

Well, it's a commitment. It's covenant. It's, it's love for my savior and feeling the love in return. It's, it's like baptism, okay? You put your foot in the water, and then you walk into the water in the font, and then you're totally immersed. And I like to feel like I'm totally immersed in the gospel. I try to...

I mean, I'm not perfect with, like, s- I'm not a scriptorian or anything like that. I, I mostly feel the gospel. I absorb the gospel rather than, than, like I said, I'm not a scriptorian or anything. And I, I do not beat myself up about, you know, things if I, if I feel like I'm, oh, I'm a little bit weak here, you know, maybe I need to work on something here.

Um, 'cause I don't believe in, um, self-defeating language or feelings. I, I want to be positive, you know, and optimistic. And yeah, being all in is like that, being totally immersed for me. This is where my joy is, is knowing that my family can be together forever, knowing that death is not the end, that it is actually just the next step in our progression, and I'll get to see my mom and my dad and my uncle and my auntie again one day.

Yeah, I am just totally all in. There you go. Well, I, I love that, that imagery of the baptismal font. We just took one of the families in our ward, we took them on kind of a baptism preview tour and, and I actually took Emma with me and- Oh ... I said, "Do you wanna go down into the font?" And we, I had her hold my arm like she'll hold her dad's arm, and showed her how she'll plug her nose.

And I think that all of those, like, little experiences that we have in the gospel, whether in nursery, whether in the home, like they all add up over time. And I love what you said about the children teaching you the gospel because- ... I feel like I, in a way, like I am learning it all over again through the eyes of my children, and I think it's a blessing to get to be around children.

And, and so I think sometimes I feel like, sometimes I feel like I see people and I'm like, "Don't, don't throw away that opportunity to, to learn through their eyes. Don't throw away the opportunity to teach them." And I, I see you, Angie, and I see Michelle and Janessa, and I think they aren't throwing that away at all, taking full opportunities.

So thank you so much for, for sharing these things and your experiences and your light with our listeners. It means a ton to me. Well, thank you for asking me.

We are so grateful to Angie Robertshaw for joining us on this week's episode. As always, we're grateful to Derek Campbell of Mix at Six Studios for his help with this episode, and we're grateful to you for listening. We'd invite you to join us next week for the last episode of this season, and we'll look forward to being with you then.