Learning to Wait Well with Heather Johnson

Kathryn Davis 00:00

The promised blessings from the Lord are sure. So how do we learn to wait well as some of those blessings take more time than we want to be fulfilled? Hi and welcome to Magnify, an LDS Living podcast where we cheer, inspire and embolden each other as women and followers of Jesus Christ. We hope to use our influence to make a difference in the world. I'm your host, Kathryn Davis, a mom, a seminary teacher, and a grilling enthusiast who loves God. We're all waiting for something from the Lord in our lives: peace, patience, a promise that has not yet been fulfilled. Our guest, Heather Johnson has been studying out why we have those waiting periods and what we are supposed to learn about ourselves while we wait for the Lord to fulfill his promises. She joins us today to help us understand what it means to wait well. Well, Heather, I'm like, so excited that you are joining us today. I've heard amazing things about you. So I'm kind of excited to pick your brain a little bit today.

Heather Johnson 01:05

Don't believe everything you hear.

Kathryn Davis 01:07

Oh, I do. I believe all the good.

heather johnson 01:09

Well, you can go with that.

Kathryn Davis 01:11

But before we get into our discussion, we have a few rapid fire questions to ask you so our listeners can get to know you a little bit better. Are you ready?

heather johnson 01:21

All right, bring them let's hear it. Okay, what do we got?

Kathryn Davis 01:23

I know you're a big runner. And you like to do races with your siblings and husband. So what is the next race you have on your calendar?

heather johnson 01:33

Okay, so we don't run like on pavement, the races that we do are actually Spartan Races, so their obstacle course races? Right. So that's why that's our gig. I have no idea because after you do one, you really question your sanity when you're done.

Kathryn Davis 01:48

You question? Yeah, how would you even get into that?

heather johnson 01:51

Yeah, so we started running them, my brothers and I actually started running them a number of years ago. And the next race we have coming up, we switched a couple years ago from the shorter like 13 mile to what's called an ultra, which is about a 33 to 36 mile race. And it has about 60 obstacles. And the next one, we're going for Montana, which is the beginning of May. So we meet up somewhere Utah's not offering the long race, which is where we usually run it. So we meet up, we're gonna meet up in Montana, the three of us will question our sanity for about 12 hours wonder if we're sane, run it, make a lot of good memories and come back. And we'll do it again next year. So that's what's next on the agenda. That's on the calendar.

Kathryn Davis 02:31

That sounds fun.

heather johnson 02:34

Yeah, that's exactly what people say when we're like, we're going to do this and they're like, great, have a great time.

Kathryn Davis 02:41

I'm so glad that's fun for you.

heather johnson 02:44

That and it's funny because I am not like a roll around in the dirt camping is not I wouldn't choose that type of thing. But it's it's this one time of year where literally, we are crawling under barbed wire and mucking through muddy rivers. And I don't know why it doesn't bug me when it's when it's in a Spartan Race. It doesn't bug me any other time of year, I would never choose it. But when we're racing, it's fun. It's really fun. And it's cool to do with family.

Kathryn Davis 03:09

That's what's so fun, right? Yeah, I love that. Okay, you also work with families and parents as a marriage and relationship coach, but you have six kids of your own? Yes, I want to know if you had one piece of advice that you could give to parents looking to strengthen their family relationships. Besides running a Spartan Race? What would that be?

heather johnson 03:33

What would it be? No, that's actually an easy one. For me, if there was just a singular piece of advice, it would be to not make things about us, which would really translate into being emotionally intelligent. If there is one thing that leads to successful families and relationships. It's an ability to manage our emotions. It is it comes down to that emotional management. And so if you've got to narrow it down to one thing, it would be that one thing that then enables us to do anything we want in a family, anything we want in a relationship, we can tackle everything if we learn to manage our emotions, which means we can't make everything mean something about us be personal to us. So that would be the one piece of advice. I only can get one. That would be it.

Kathryn Davis 04:16

Oh, I love that. Well, I'm excited to kind of ask you a little bit more about that. But here's my last question for you. We are approaching spring. And hopefully, the weather's gonna get a little warmer. What is something fun that you are looking forward to doing with your family?

heather johnson 04:34

So as soon I guess it's more summer, but one of our favorite things to do is golf together. And also just be at the pool. I grew up in Southern California. And so as soon as the sun comes out and the pool is open, it's the closest I can get to saltwater. And so that's something where there's a lot going on during the week. We're working things like that, but Saturdays are very much At the pool. Saturdays are a day where nothing else gets get are worried about. So that's always what I'm most looking forward to always. There's one other thing this year we have our oldest is our son. He comes home from a mission in a couple of weeks. And so that's right on the cusp of spring, summer. And so above even the pool, which is hard to be, because we do wait all week to go hang out at the pool. We're looking forward to him coming home. We're excited to see him again.

Kathryn Davis 05:21

Where is he serving right now?

heather johnson 05:23

He's in Denmark.

Kathryn Davis 05:24

So fun. That is the best hug ever when they come home.

heather johnson 05:29

Yeah, we haven't gotten it'll be our first time. He's our he's our first missionary and our oldest. He's also our only boy. He's our only boys. So out of those six kids. You mentioned, five of them are girls, and he's our only boy. And he's our oldest. So it's going to be super sweet to have him home.

Kathryn Davis 05:43

The girls are going to be so excited to have him home.

heather johnson 05:45

They're they're counting down. Yeah.

Kathryn Davis 05:48

Well, I am excited to talk to you a little bit today. You talk about how we can wait. Well. And I want to ask you a little bit about this principle. And can you tell me where this principle came from? And how it relates to waiting for the Lord?

heather johnson 06:06

Yeah, so I think that this is very much become a mantra for me starting about nine years ago, where essentially kind of two things came together at the same time. First was, it was a period of time where my husband sustained a really significant back injury. And so at that point in time, it was literally about two weeks after we had our fifth child, and he got hurt, and essentially spent the next 24 months in bed. And I remember spending really long nights by myself with this brand new baby, constantly asking myself when this was going to end. He had back surgery that was supposed to make it better. But the inflammation made it worse. I mean, all these complications kept happening. And I was in this position where as I paced around and nursed and you know dealt with this baby, especially in the dark of night alone, I realized I was waiting for him to be pain free. I was waiting for him to not be depressed, I was waiting for a companion to come back. I just was waiting. And I had all of this waiting that was going on. And it was hard. It was really hard to wait and not know if it would ever end there came a point where I remember thinking, I need to accept that this might never end. It might always be like this. And so I think that that's where my own personal journey with figuring out how to wait well came about. Because I was in this situation where I might need to wait forever. I didn't know. It was at the same time that I found myself in the Scriptures reading about John the Baptist and reading about his parents and reading about Elizabeth and Zacharias. And reading through and recognizing that Elizabeth was waiting. Elizabeth waited, what 86, 88 years are really long time to have John the Baptist. And as I was reading it, and it dawned on me that it was never a question of if she would have a baby. God didn't wonder this plan had been put in place, way, way, way, way, way before Elizabeth ever found herself waiting. But here was a situation where it wasn't about if she would have John the Baptist, Heavenly Father was really curious in my mind about what Elizabeth was going to do while she waited. It wasn't a matter of if my husband and I if he would get healthy. Eventually he would get healthy. Even if it was in the next life. There would be a time when he had health. That wasn't on the table. But I had to realize wait a second Heavenly Father actually wants to see what I'm going to do while I wait. And it's in the waiting that the challenges come. It's in the waiting that the growth shows up. It's in the waiting where Heavenly Father is anxious to see what's Heather going to do while she waits. And understanding that we're all waiting for something. Right, someone right now is waiting for a spouse to get healthy. Someone is waiting to feel like they have control over anxiety. Someone is waiting for marriage or to feel less alone. They're waiting to hear about a job. We're all waiting. And it isn't that heavenly father doesn't know the plan. He knows the plan perfectly. I think it's that he's anxious to see what we're going to do while we wait. And Elizabeth shows us that right in the scriptures. We come to know we come to know what she did. She was righteous before God she walked blameless. She and her husband got closer together. Right? She spent her life really faithfully serving the Lord. It says those things in the scriptures. So put me in a position where I had to kind of do a gut check and go, Okay, well, heavenly Father knows how this is going to end up. But what am I going to do while I wait? I gotta figure out how to wait well. And I think you're right. We are all waiting for different things, whether that's for children or waiting for things for our children or waiting for health or promised blessings. We're all waiting for a promised blessing knowing that eventually we will receive those blessings but I like that idea of waiting well. So as you thought about that, and as you've thought about Elizabeth, what are some principles You've learned about how to wait Well? Because I like that idea. But how do we do that? What does that look like? And I think sometimes we answer this question by saying things like, pray or read your scriptures. And I love those answers, and they're right answers. But sometimes they become very cliche where I can pray all I want, and I'm still waiting. And so I think sometimes those answers leave us falling a little bit short. So I know for me, I think there's a couple of things that are super important. One of them is to be like Enoch. And what I mean by this is, if we remind ourselves of the story of Enoch, Heavenly Father essentially wants to use him and wants him to be of service to Him. And Enoch says, I'm not good enough. I'm, what slow of speech and people don't really like me, and I don't have a lot of experience. And he doesn't feel like he's able. And we learned from his story that he's qualified not because he has all the abilities and the skills, he's qualified because he was available, and he was willing. And that availability and that willingness is so important. I think one of the first things we can do when we're learning to wait well, is to simply be available and willing to wait to be like Enoch, and be willing. I don't think we will often recognize that the willingness, the availability that qualifies us, we're qualified to be assisted and helped in the waiting when we're available. And when we're willing. That qualified Enoch. I think that's a really cool place to start where we take a step back and go, Wait a second, I can qualify myself for all of this help, and all of this patience and all of the support that comes from my Heavenly Father and people around me, simply by being willing to wait. Lots of times we push against that right?

Kathryn Davis 11:48

Or we want to hurry and get through it?

heather johnson 11:50

Yes, instead of recognizing that the qualifications come in the availability, and in that willingness. So I think that helps a ton. I also think it's really important when we're learning to wait that we have as many experiences with the spirit as we possibly can. One of my favorite stories in the scriptures is Moses, I love this experience he has where he hangs out with Heavenly Father and God shows him everything. And it feels like to me that heavenly father goes out the back door just to Satan comes in the front door. Right? They just miss each other. Oh, yes. And same steps in and he starts to challenge him. And he wants Moses to question what he's just been through or what he's just seen or where he's headed. And I love that Moses draws upon his experiences with the spirit in order to get through the challenges that Satan brings. And waiting well is the exact same experience to me, where relying on experiences we've had with the spirit are what allow us to get through the moments where Satan is tempting us to quit the wait, where Satan is tempting us to question if we can endure or question if God is aware of us. When we're waiting, that's one of the first things we do is we start to question if God is Aware, right? At month 18, when my husband still is hurt, and in bed, it's really easy to wonder if God has any idea what our family is dealing with, and if he's going to attend to us. But relying on the experiences we've had with the Spirit allows us just like Moses to get through the times when we wonder, to get through the times when Satan is tempting us, to be these experiences with the spirit and cultivating them. Whatever that looks like for us is imperative to wait well, because we can utilize that it is such a beautiful tool to use when we have Satan tempting us to not wait well. So I think that's something else that's really, really, really important when we're waiting.

Kathryn Davis 13:41

So I have a question about that. So you talked about like cultivating those moments where we feel the spirit? What if at month 18 It's hard to feel the spirit. What do you do then?

heather johnson 13:52

Yeah, in those situations, and we all face them, right, especially when we're trying to wait well? We find ourselves in this position where we have to make a decision again. We can rely on times in the past when we felt the Spirit to help us carry through. But I think this is where it's so vitally important to start managing the emotions that we experience. Because what happens is, we tend to think that we need to feel something in order to do it. And society is actually giving us this message all the time, right that if you feel it, then go ahead and do it. But if you don't feel it, then you shouldn't have to or you don't need to. So this is where we're going to fall back on the values and principles that we subscribe to. And we're going to recognize and trust that the feelings we're looking for manifest themselves after we act instead of before. And that's what gets us through these moments when we don't feel like doing it like waiting well. When we can't rely on those feelings of the spirit from the past, We're going to rely on the values we subscribe to and follow through with them. We're going to do the thing that needs done because we believe it's the right thing and then the feeling show up. So let's do some examples of this. so that it makes a little bit more sense, right? A really good example of this would be serving someone. Have you ever had the prompting that you should? Or the thought that you need to serve someone, but you don't feel like it?

Kathryn Davis 15:10

Oh, yeah. I do. Yeah.

heather johnson 15:14

All the time, right. I feel this when someone reaches out and says, Hey, can you take dinner to this family? And then they follow it up with? There's 12 of them. Can you do it in 30 minutes? And I'm sitting in my office and I haven't left yet. Right. And although I believe in service, and I also want to be very dependable, I don't necessarily feel like figuring that out in that moment. Yeah, right. Yeah. If we only went off of how we felt a lot of us, we wouldn't serve that much if we went off of how we felt. Yeah, so instead, in those moments we serve, because for me, I believe in being dependable, and I want to follow through with those things. And without fail, without fail. After I drop off that meal, I am filled with gratitude for the opportunity that I had to serve. And I even find myself asking heavenly Father to give me or to request that of me again, which is so weird, because when I was asked to do it 30 minutes earlier. That's not how I felt. The feelings come after the actions when we're stuck like that. But we're quick to wait around for the feelings and because they're not there, we don't ever act. So we want to reverse that. Right? Yeah. Here's another example that maybe many of us have felt where you have a baby who cries in the middle of the night. Okay, what do you feel like doing at three o'clock, when one of your kids cried for food?

Kathryn Davis 16:33

Me, I want to, like tap my husband roll back over in bed and go to sleep. You go do it?

heather johnson 16:38

Yeah, that's exactly right. We we feel like sleeping. Yeah, we feel like staying in bed. We don't feel like getting up, okay. But we get up. How come we get up? We get up because getting up and attending to that baby follows the value system that we subscribe to, it supports it. And then we have an experience where we get in there and we change them, and we feed them and we swaddle them, and we get them back to sleep. And we find ourselves thanking our Heavenly Father for the feelings of gratitude and connection and closeness with that baby. But those feelings didn't show up until after we did the thing. Yeah, so when we find ourselves at month, 18, we have to start doing things because they line up with where we want to go. And the values we subscribe to, trusting that the feelings manifest themselves after those actions. Up to month 18, we've been able to rely on those feelings that have come from past experiences with the Spirit. But sometimes it's hard to hang on to that. And so that's when that value system takes over. We follow through with that. And then we get those feelings, but we have to act first. And so that's how we can navigate those situations. When we feel like it's hard to rely on the feelings of the past.

Kathryn Davis 17:55

That's so good. You were talking about Moses and Satan coming in that back door. And I also think Satan is so good at one thing that he always tries to do is he's like, Oh, Moses, Son of man, like always trying to take away our divine identity and our purpose. And I'm just wondering what you've learned about waiting well that has taught you about your divine identity and your divine worth?

heather johnson 18:24

Yeah, I actually love that question and this connection, because what happens is, when we're not mindful when we're trying to wait on something big or small, what we find ourselves doing is, unfortunately, unhealthy thinking leads us to question our worth, yeah, where we find ourselves going, well, maybe I did something wrong. Or when maybe I'm not good enough. Maybe this has something to do with me. And we're really quick to make the waiting means something about us not being enough. Instead of recognizing that waiting is actually part of our existence here on Earth. It's part of being human, it's part of our human experience waiting is. But when we don't manage those emotions, our mind starts to tell us that the waiting is because we are not enough. And so we question our worth, and we question it so quickly. It's funny how we immediately go to right and I'm not enough space, yeah. And make the waiting means something about us. But the waiting doesn't have to mean something about us.

Kathryn Davis 19:22

Why do we do that? Why do we go so quickly to make it mean something about us?

heather johnson 19:27

It's this easy space we go to because we're trying to come up with some sort of solution for why it's happening. And we don't actually know we can't pinpoint. And so to manage that anxiousness we go very quickly to well, it must be about me and I can control me so I'm gonna go ahead and try to be perfect or do it different in order to manage the anxiousness I feel about the fact that I'm still waiting on this and it's still a challenge. And so part of waiting well is not making it about us that way is not questioning our worth. The scriptures are full of such cool examples of not making it about us of this space of worth, right? Yeah, my favorite is when we have the story of Satan tempting the Savior. And I don't know about in your Sunday school classes, but in mine over the course of my life, anytime we talk about this story, we're very quick to talk about the different ways we're tempted, right? Physical and yeah, yeah, we do that really quick, right? The thing that I actually take from that story is that Satan tempted the Savior the same way every time. He started every temptation by actually saying to him, If thou art the Son of God, and again, if thou art the Son of God, and the third time he questioned him. When Satan wants the Savior to fall, he questions his worth. And it is the exact same thing he does with us when he wants us to given to quit to not endure it well, he questions our worth. He tries to get us to question, if we're enough. It's Satan's tool. And so recognizing that it's Satan's tool is so helpful, we can call it out and say, I know what this is, I know where this is coming from. And once we can call it out, that way, we can do something with it, when we recognize it. There's also that secondary part to that story that I think is so powerful, where the Savior responds to Satan the same way every time. His response is always and so it is written. And he goes back to the Scripture, yep. And back to the Scriptures again. And I really love this idea of coming to understand our worth. And the Savior teaches us where to do that, that if we spend our time in the scriptures and come to better know the nature of our heavenly Father, us being created in His image means that we then can better understand who we are, because we are created in His image that way. And so looking at it that way, and recognizing, okay, Satan's the one you wants me to tell myself that the waiting is because I'm not enough. That's a tool he uses. If he's going to use it on the Savior, we can guarantee that he's using it on us. And it's every day. Yeah, absolutely. It's everywhere. Let's do some like outside examples and see it a little bit. This would be a situation where maybe we've made dinner for our family. And we ask if somebody wants seconds. And they say no, thanks. I'm full. But we hear you don't like my cooking. Right? Right. Which turns into I'm not a good cook, right, which turns into no one around here appreciates. I'm not a good mom, which turns into I'm not a good mom, which turns into I'm not enough. Now we've just questioned our worth, we've made it about us. If we're not careful. We do this everywhere. So when we look at the scriptures again, to kind of back this up, we can start with our Heavenly Father, who loses a third of his spirit children. And nowhere do we ever imply that it was because he wasn't a good enough Heavenly Father? Or that maybe his plan wasn't sufficient, or I don't know, maybe you need a different representation. Right? Instead, we recognize that third had agency. And it doesn't mean anything about God being enough, right? We can do it with Lehi, who's got Laman and Lemuel and Nephi and Sam. And they're in this same situation where, I don't know, in my mind Laman and Lemuel started all the world wars, anything bad that's ever happened all started because an angel wasn't enough for those two boys. Right?

Kathryn Davis 23:23

Yes. But sometimes I feel like they kind of get a bad rap.

heather johnson 23:27

I do too. I do too. We can see it that way. Right? And we never imply though, or look at it and go, Well, you know what, maybe Lehi was a bad dad. It isn't about him, right? We don't look and say, Well, maybe if he would have let them stay in Jerusalem? Or maybe if they could have kept half the gold and silver, then maybe they would have chosen different we recognize that there's agency there that it's a part of the plan. Hmm. So then I think as women we find ourselves in this position where we go to okay, but yeah, if I just did it perfect, then I'd be okay. Then I wouldn't have to wait, then my husband's back would be better, or I would get the job that I need, or I wouldn't deal with and have to wait to not feel anxious anymore. And we actually have an example of that. Also, if we look at the Savior, the Savior actually did it perfectly. He did it perfect. He taught people just like we sit next to people, he taught them and when they were done, he said, Will you come follow me? And they said, no, never once do we? Or do the scriptures imply that it was because the Savior taught it wrong or wasn't enough, ever? And we know it can't be that way. Because we have that testimony that he was perfect. We know he did it perfectly. And still part of the plan was that they get to choose part of their mortal experience was that they get to choose. And when we're not managing our thinking, we go to this place that we're not enough and we make it about us. And as soon as we do that, we lose our ability to wait well. It gets so clouded and we get so defensive about trying to figure out and solve it, that we don't realize that waiting isn't challenging our worth. They're not connected in any way. We could do it perfect, which perfect is just being afraid to fail. And still, we have to wait. Even if we were perfect, just like the Savior who did it perfectly, and still, they didn't follow him.

Kathryn Davis 25:25

So is that you talk a lot about managing our emotions and controlling our thoughts. And even that was your one piece of advice that you would give your children is that the first step in controlling our thoughts is questioning what that thought is, and then questioning if we're making it about us or not?

heather johnson 25:43

Yep, always, the first step is to go to where we're we are in our heads and managing what that narrative is, right? We tend to think that our feelings are facts, but our feelings are byproducts of how we think. And so when we make sure that those thoughts line up with our values, which, me not being enough, that doesn't line up with my value system. And so anytime, the way we're talking to ourselves, or the way we're thinking in our minds don't line up with our values, we know that they're unhealthy, we know we want to make a change with that. And so looking at it and recognizing, okay, I know my worth. And that's what waiting well has for sure taught me. It's allowed me to recognize that waiting doesn't have anything to do with my worth, that my worth is a birthright that stands alone, that all the challenges can show up, the things I don't understand can show up. And it doesn't ever mean, I'm worth less, it doesn't ever mean that I'm not enough. It does mean I'm facing a challenge. It does mean that something's hard. But it doesn't challenge that space of being a daughter of God. And that being a daughter of God is enough. And so that's where we always want to start. Everything starts in between our ears without thinking. And so we always want to learn to put our energy there. We want to learn how to do that really well. How cool to think that when we're waiting, it gives us opportunities to learn to manage our emotions. It gives us opportunities to learn to be more willing, waiting provides us so many opportunities if we'll take it. And it's in the waiting that the growth happens. It's in the waiting that the refinement happens. But we don't see waiting as an opportunity. We tend to see waiting as a punishment. And waiting isn't. It's not a punishment, it is an opportunity if we're willing to manage it and think about it that way.

Kathryn Davis 27:36

So I think back of your story about your husband when he was sick and in bed, and you had to wait for quite a while. What was something that you learned during that period of waiting?

heather johnson 27:51

That's a good question. There are a number of things that I've learned that have stuck, right, that make an impact, and then I'm able to take into the next waiting phase. Because like we said, everyone's always waiting for something somehow, right? We're now I'm not actually waiting for my husband to get healthy. Yeah.

Kathryn Davis 28:08

What are you waiting on now?

heather johnson 28:10

I think now for me, if I had to pinpoint what I'm waiting, I think a lot of the things I'm waiting on now are more professional, and waiting for better understanding. I think they're spaces professionally, where I'm actually waiting for the courage to enact some of the things that I know I need to do. Right, which is a strange place to wait in to know,

Kathryn Davis 28:28

I understand that.

heather johnson 28:29

but also have the courage to enact. I think I'm waiting for some courage, and I'm waiting for some direction all at the same time. I know some of the things that I've learned that the waiting has taught me is to not lose my confidence. My very favorite scripture, I think you guys call it an SOS scripture. Yeah, it's not just SOS for me. It's it's literally my lifeline is Hebrews 10: 35 and 36 which says cast ye not therefore away your confidence which have great recompense for reward. And I love verse 36, that says, for ye have need of patience that after you've done the will of God, you'll receive the promise. Not casting away my confidence in what I've come to know, is part of how I personally wait well. I hang on desperately to the times I've known something and the confidence that I've gained the ability to manage my thinking. And I use that in order to wait well, and that ability is something that I've learned in this process.

Kathryn Davis 29:21

I just want to say I love that thought though, because, you know, I think we like you said we're all waiting on something. And right now I have some specific things that I'm waiting on. Right? Whether that's like healing for family members, and waiting on some clear direction for work. And some questions I've had and some bumps in the road and it's so easy for me to go straight to well, it's not happening because I'm not doing enough or maybe if I prayed harder, or maybe if I had more faith, you know, my family member would be healed. I love that scripture in Hebrews because it It's so easy for me to go there.

heather johnson 30:01

For sure. And to go to that place, right? Like you just said, we're now we're making it about us again, yeah, where you're not good enough. And so that's why you're having to wait, or that's why these challenges are happening. And yet, we know oftentimes the directions we should head or what waiting does look like, but we lose confidence in what we've come to know. We cast away our confidence. And as soon as we do that, there's there's no room for the reward. Right? Yeah. And then there's that patience piece that's so important. So this is a big one for me. I remember I actually heard that Scripture from elder Holland when I was a student at BYU. And he gave that talk that we've probably all listened to so many times. And as I sat there and listened to him, I'm pretty sure I was the only one in the Marriott center that day as he gave that talk. And since then, it is what allows me to wait well, to not cast away the confidence in the things I've come to know. And sometimes I think what we've come to know is simply small, like, I know this will end. It might be eternal, but it's gonna end, or I know that I have endurance or stamina, or I know that this is the direction I should head. I don't know how. But I at one point in time, knew that this is where I need to go. And so hanging on to those things and not losing our confidence. That's a big one. I also have learned to be really intentional in the waiting. And I think that that's something that's so important, this need to be very deliberate or intentional when we wait. To me intentional means that we have a working plan. It means we have goals, it means that we don't let the pressures and influences of everyday impact the direction that we go. And so I think another thing that I've learned is that that deliberateness, that intentionality is key to waiting well, to not letting outside influences impact the direction that I need to head. Because they try to right? Satan tries to get us to really struggle in the wait.

Kathryn Davis 31:57

Or to stop.

heather johnson 31:58

Or just to quit altogether.

Kathryn Davis 32:00

Yeah, I like that idea of moving in a direction because I think it's so easy to feel so overwhelmed or so unsure about the waiting that we just stop.

heather johnson 32:09

that we just stop. And it's hard to not know when something's going to end, especially when it's painful, it's hard to not know how something is going to turn out. Right? That's yeah, that's really uncomfortable. And so to be able to sit still and be uncomfortable is also something that I know I've learned in the waiting. Waiting can be uncomfortable. And that's okay. We are so quick to think if it's uncomfortable that we have to change it immediately, because we can't be uncomfortable. But waiting is uncomfortable, and being willing, again, like Enoch, that the willingness and the availability qualifies us to go, Okay, I'm available, and I'm very willing to recognize that this isn't going to be comfortable and uncomfortable is okay. It's okay. And I think that's something powerful to recognize, I know that it's taught me to trust in God's plan, I have a greater understanding of opposition, as a result of waiting. I think I better understand the nature of God, and I'm close with him.

Kathryn Davis 33:07

What have you learned about the nature of God?

heather johnson 33:09

I think when I think about now, who God is or what my relationship is to him, there is so much compassion. And I genuinely believe that He is compassionate. I know that to be true. I know that the nature of God is to help us all return to him not to to exclude people, his intention is that we all get to come home. And I think that if God had his way, which I recognize he can but can't, that He wants everyone there. I don't know if we always know that when we're waiting. We wonder if he's trying to weed some of us out instead of recognizing that he's always there. And his nature is that to me that he is always there. So I know because I better understand His nature, that if I'm feeling a distance, it's because I've created it, not because he's created it. Those things provide comfort. I know that he knows me. And he knows that I'm waiting. And he knows that it's uncomfortable. And he's okay with it, too. Because he knows that if I stick with it, the refinement process will be well worth it. Right. I know that he has a big picture. And he knows where it's taking us. All those things to me are part of his nature, his compassion and his love and his attentiveness. I know he's very attentive. And I appreciate that waiting has taught me those things.

Kathryn Davis 34:26

Well, and how powerful right? that we can really come to know our Heavenly Father and our Savior in the wait. That waiting it is part of the plan.

heather johnson 34:39

And it doesn't mean that I don't think we'll ever come to a point where we're like, Yes, I hope I have to wait longer. Right or Heavenly Father, give me more things to wait for. I don't think I mean, do you I don't think we'll ever get to that point where that's, you know, we're begging for the wait?

Kathryn Davis 34:55

Yeah, no, I do not think so. at all. But I love that idea of recognizing, like you said earlier, when that wait has come, can I recognize it? Can I accept the weight and not fight against it?

heather johnson 35:10

And given that we're all going to have to do it. And we've all already done it, and it isn't going anywhere, because our lives are not on demand, right? They're not where we have a remote. And we're like, Yep, this is exactly. And I'm going to program exactly how I want today to go. Given that we're all going to have to keep doing it. Even just simply waiting for the Savior to come again, we might as well put our energy into figuring out how to do it well. We might as well put our energy into growing while we're waiting, given that we're all going to have to wait to use that time in a way that benefits us instead of that makes us miserable. And I think sometimes even just that helps us be willing and available to wait.

Kathryn Davis 35:53

Then that waiting becomes sacred time. And I often think of the waiting when God cares more about our growth than he does our comfort. And I think for me, those waiting periods are not comfortable. But that's where I can grow.

heather johnson 36:09

I don't know if we could grow if we weren't waiting. I mean, if we put growth and comfort, if we put all those things together. I'm not sure how much growth can happen when we're super comfortable. Because we're not seeking it. It's in the fact that we're at a deficit that we go look for ways to grow, or that we ask God for help that we seek him out. Because we need the help because it's uncomfortable. When we're comfortable. I don't know how many of us are running to grow, because things feel real good. So we don't feel like we need to.

Kathryn Davis 36:39

Right. Well, I have loved our conversation. I especially I keep thinking about what you said about not making it about me. And I think I do that a lot. Because I like to change things. And if there's something that I can control or manage better than it's, it's me, right? I can do it. And so we love to end every episode with a small and simple challenge, or something that we can learn or something that we can implement through the week. So what is your small and simple challenge to us that can help us wait well?

heather johnson 37:17

Okay, so let's actually make that our challenge to not make things about us. Let's take the challenge altogether, to not put waiting next to our worth, right, to disconnect those two things. So that's going to mean that the challenge is anytime we make it about us, or we hear like you just said, maybe if I did it different, or I prayed more, right? Anytime we find ourselves in that space, let's take the challenge to replace that thought with one that does line up with the values that we subscribe to just a tiny replacement. Even if all we get to is I'm trying every day that redirects us so that our waiting isn't tied to our worth. Because we can't wait well when we tie it to our worth. So let's take that as the challenge. Just even if there's once where we don't make something about us where we don't attach it to our worth, then we've done a really good thing.

Kathryn Davis 38:12

I think that's such a powerful place to start, which begins the change and so many of our thoughts. Heather, seriously. Thank you so much. So fun to talk to you.

heather johnson 38:23

This has been fun. This has been great.

Kathryn Davis 38:26

I loved that conversation with Heather today and how much it taught me about recognizing and accepting the wait. And most importantly, understanding that waiting isn't tied to our self worth. And with that thought I think it can change our emotions and bring so much power into our waiting and it truly can become a time where we can wait well. Thanks for being here and hop on over to Instagram at magnify community for more inspiration and conversation. And of course subscribe and listen to the Magnify podcast wherever you get your shows. Let's meet up again next week.