Tammy Uzelac Hall 0:00
Okay, I want everyone to just clear their minds. Take a minute, clear your mind and close your eyes and sit back and imagine the scenario that I'm going to give you. Imagine yourself in a boat sailing on the ocean. It is a perfect day on the water, the sun is shining, there is a slight breeze and all is well. After enjoying this perfect day, you see off in the distance a storm, and it's kind of rapidly approaching, but clouds begin to pick up and they are rolling toward you, you carefully calculate that there is no way you can make it to the shore for safety. So the only thing you can do is batten down the hatches, drop an anchor and hope for the best. Now, imagine that anchor, is it big? Is it sturdy? Can you trust it? What is it look like? Are you confident in its ability to study your boat during the storm? Well, today's discussion of Hebrews chapters one through six has us examining a specific anchor, and the good it can do during the most tumultuous of storms that all of us will encounter in this life. Welcome to the Sunday on Monday Study Group, a desert bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS Living where we take the Come follow me lesson for the week and we really dig into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall. Now if you're new to our study group, we want to make sure you know how to use this podcast. So please follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your Come follow me study just like my friend April Lorsch. From Gilbert, Arizona. Hi, April. Now another awesome thing about this study group is each week we're joined by two of my friends. So it's always a little bit different. And oh, I am counting on today being different because these two guests are the greatest people. I love them so much. It is DeeDee and Steve. Ebola Hello, friends. Hello. We're so excited. I love you too, so much. And I've never met any two people like them before. And you will find out why as we carry on as we have this discussion because you they are full of life. Like that's another way I can describe you guys. You're the most upbeat, happy, just go go go. I mean I've million things to say about you. You're awesome. That's the bottom line.
DeeDee Abaroa 2:16
Well, I love that you think that we're upbeat? And we're go, go, go. I'm so glad you don't witness that I have to take my afternoon nap each and every afternoon now that I'm retired.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 2:28
Well, maybe that's why it works. Maybe that's why you are the nap. Oh, I like that. You guys tell the audience where you're from and a little bit about yourself?
Steve Abaroa 2:38
Well, we are living here in San Tan Valley, which is the tiny little corner bar away from Phoenix. And we moved down here from Provo to become school teachers for the Gilbert school district. And so we've been here 38 years, something like that. And I taught high school at Gilbert and then Highland High School where I taught English journalism and theater.
DeeDee Abaroa 3:09
And yeah, I am actually a native of Arizona and by birth but I actually grew up in Provo, Utah. I look at those mountains and I claim them as my own. But we did as teachers moved to Arizona, and we we just fell in love with the desert. I actually have to tell you one thing about Steve. He's from San Diego and that was the first thing that I thought oh, I love San Diego all move there. Oh, sure. We've never lived there ever. We are here in the desert. And we love it. We love it. And do you have kids? We do we have four rambunctious, bearded boys. And they're fun. We have seven and three quarters grandchildren's. So we're a little bit on baby watch and waiting for our newest little gram daughter to arrive. And we love them all. And it's so fun. Our oldest is actually our bishop and that makes that really an interesting experience. Yeah, yeah. Do we have a loving tender Bishop? Yes, for most, but does he talk to me like a mother? Yes. He talks to me like a mother.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 4:20
Boy, nothing will keep you on the straight and narrow than having your old child you have to go talk to you about things. These might be the best five years of your life spiritually. Right.
Steve Abaroa 4:28
He's, he's hilarious in church because he will never say brother or sister ever or he'll just say, Hey, Dad will give the opening prayer or because DeeDee is the steak Relief Society president he'll say mom has a message to all the women. So he always mom and dad right over the pulpit.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 4:48
No, I like that. That's cute.
DeeDee Abaroa 4:50
It's fun. He's crazy. And speaking of our sons, our oldest son is an author his books are on desert book we he loves to write. So We're excited for him that his books are are on desert book.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 5:04
And by the way, if you want to know more about their son's books, you can find a link in our show notes that will take you right to desert book.com. And purchase those. It's a suspense thriller kind of genre. So it's awesome. So now here, here's a fun fact about these two that you also want to know is they have a very significant role to play in the amazing, gigantic Easter pageant that takes place every year in Arizona. So quickly, just tell us a little bit about that.
Steve Abaroa 5:30
Well, I'm one of the artistic directors for the pageant. And it is. It is something really special to be able to work with people and to be able to recreate the whole life of Christ because we go from birth to resurrection. And it's, it's just, it's kind of hard to explain. It's the new pageants, the one that has kind of been around for 70 years when the temple was being remodeled. We went on hiatus for a while totally redid the everything music wise, the story is still the same. We haven't changed the Bible. But we created new songs recreated a lot of the costumes, the set, beautiful stage that we have now. And because there's so few pageants now in the church, the church has been able to help us to expand it or to have a little more creativity with it. So it is if you haven't seen it, grab a non member, come on down. And Tammy, your room is still waiting for you to I know. One of these days, family down.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 6:52
I'm coming down. We're staying in your Casita, and we're going to see that pageant. DeeDee do you know about how many people end up coming to see this pageant every year?
DeeDee Abaroa 6:59
Oh, my goodness, it is incredible. It I study, you may have to help me. But it's we will get anywhere from eight to 10,000 per night. And a lot of it is a traditional activity for families to go to that and be reminded the significance of Easter. But the greatest thing is that there are so many community members, we have a lot of winter visitors that come and they are amazed at the excess. I mean, it's just incredible how large and vast that stage is in the story. And of course, to work with a story that is the greatest story of all, is such a spiritual experience to bear our testimonies each and every night. I used to be on the front stage with the pageant for 20 some odd years with our little boys. We intentionally wanted to be a part of the pageant so that we would feel His love and I, we deliberately chose to be a part of that for that very reason. But in these last few years, I've been backstage and not on the front stage. And I'll tell you that's a whole nother pageant. That's a whole nother story backstage as opposed to front stage. But oh my goodness, it is it's it's such a sweet treat. Such a beautiful blessing. Wow.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 8:23
Well, thank you. Oh my gosh, well, for those of you listening, if you want to know more about my guests and read their bios and see their pictures, you can find them in our show notes which are at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday. So make sure you go and check that out and check out there son's book as well. All right, everybody. So grab your scriptures, your scripture journal and something to mark your Scriptures with. And let's dig into the book of Hebrews. Okay, do either one of you remember pass along cards? For church tracks?
DeeDee Abaroa 8:50
All my goodness? Yeah. Love those. Those pictures were awesome. Did I pass them along? Well, not so good at collecting them. They were awesome.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 9:00
What? What was the point of a pass along card or a church tract?
Steve Abaroa 9:05
To try to get the word to other people, especially your non member prints to kind of show them what we believe?
Tammy Uzelac Hall 9:11
Yes, you're exactly right. Okay, so turn to the very first page of the book of Hebrews. And somewhere on that page, right church tract or pass along card, because some scholars believe and I think this is one of the best explanations of the book of Hebrews, that Hebrews may have been written as a missionary tract or a pass along card. The whole goal is Hebrews contains one of the longest running arguments in the New Testament for the superiority of Jesus and His law over the law of Moses. Isn't that fascinating. So that was the goal of the book of Hebrews was to convince people of who Jesus Christ was and what his new law now contained. And so I just think this is pretty awesome. The whole point of it was to convert people to Christ and His gospel. So let's talk about who wrote the book of Hebrews. So somewhere on this page, you can also put this There is debate. But the majority of scholars agree it was Paul, who wrote the book of Hebrews. That is why Hebrews is at the very end of all of the letters that we have been studying. Because even though it's bigger than because we talked out early in the year, the books are in order of size, not when they were written. But Hebrews is bigger than the other books. They just put it at the end because they were like, we're not sure if Paul wrote it. But if we did, we're going to include it right here. They think Paul wrote it because there is mentioned his companion Timothy, as well as some language that he uses. He'll say, Grace be with you all, amen, which is a typical Pauline closing in His scriptures. And we also have the Prophet Joseph Smith, who did say that Paul wrote the book of Hebrews. Now, if this book was written by Paul as a tool for conversion to Jesus and His gospel, then I think this is so cool. And you don't get to hear the prayers we say at the beginning of each episode. But I wish you could have heard DeeDee's prayer, because it was so Christ centered. And that is what the book of Hebrews is. And your prayer was perfect, because I kept thinking she doesn't even know what I'm about to say, which is we get to talk about Jesus for an hour. And that is what you prayed about. And that is so cool. And it made us all a little bit weepy. So to start out, then what I want to know is just tell me briefly, what stood out to you from the book of Hebrews. We have been studying the letters by asking my guests to share with us what stood out to you in these letters. So if Paul were because we joke if Paul saw the church today, we'd be getting a letter. So share with us overlanders are several letters. Yes. So I'm curious what stood out to you from Hebrews?
Steve Abaroa 11:37
Well, one thing for me a couple of times in these first six chapters, Paul said, Take heed, and don't fall away. He says that several times, listen. And it's kind of like stay on the boat, people. Because I was looking through this, it's, it's kind of the Jewish converts were being chastised and being laughed at. And some of them were started falling away. And so Paul's saying, Hey, hang in there, people hang in there. And know that Jesus is the Christ. And that he's, he's there for you. And that's kind of what I took from these first chapters.
DeeDee Abaroa 12:27
And, you know, I love I love what Steve said that. And I love what you said to Tammy, that, that it is all about Jesus. And I think when we look at who Paul was writing this for, oh, my goodness, I was profoundly touched that I think he was writing it for me. And I think he was writing it for you. And I think he was writing it for our day. And I love that it is so it's so simple. If we just if we just don't over analyze everything in the scriptures, and just remember, Jesus is an everything in every verse in every chapter. And in this particular collection of the chapters one through six in Hebrews, I was so blown away by the additional titles and roles of Jesus. And I was profoundly touched. And I thought, You know what, I don't know if Paul knew who I was. But I think he may have had an inkling that there's going to be a woman who's going to be so needing these words. And I think her name is going to be TV. I think he wrote him for me,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 13:40
I think you might be right.
Steve Abaroa 13:42
Like DeeDee said, it's not just to the converts way back when it's for us converts today, because we're still facing some of the same things they did. Where people are ridiculing us and making fun of us, or telling us Oh, there's a simpler way. There's a better way and people start falling away. And so it's if we can put Paul or put Hebrews into our terms today, he's still talking to us and saying stay in the boat. Just stay in the boat. Because Jesus is your Christ. Look at the things that he has done. He is your Christ. So just stick with them.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 14:31
You know, thank you to both of you for what you shared. And you both just your comments gelled so well together. And DeeDee, you kept saying the word profound, it was profoundly significant to you. It was very profound that words stuck out to me as you were speaking, and you talked about the titles for Christ. And so I just had this like, Aha because I thought she is so right. And this will be really neat to see if after talking about all of these chapters how profoundly they, I mean, I'm just trying to think that that word, it is profound. And it is significant for us and our date. And Steve, going back to what you said like stay in the boat. Let's see what Hebrews one through six is going to teach us about staying and how profoundly it will affect our lives by learning these titles. I'm so grateful DeeDee, you mentioned that. So let's dig into the titles of Christ. We're going to do that in the next segment.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 15:32
All right, so dealey beautifully set this up. I asked my guests to come prepared. I have them read Hebrews one through six. And I asked them to mark as many titles or roles for Jesus Christ in these chapters. Are you too ready to do this?
DeeDee Abaroa 15:46
So ready? Are, okay?
Tammy Uzelac Hall 15:48
So what I want you to do is just give us the chapter in the verse. So we know what to mark. And let's follow DeeDee and Steve, as they teach us all the different roles and names for Christ hit it.
DeeDee Abaroa 15:59
Okay, I'll jump in. I'll do it my darling, here we go. It is it was so amazing to me. Now, some of these titles I have heard before. But so let's go to Hebrews chapter one, for example. And verse two, he's talking, the words are saying heir appointed heir of all things, or by his son. So we know that He is the Son of God, and we know some of those titles. But then, when we get into verse three, I had never considered that, who being the brightness of his glory, the title of He is the brightness of his glory, and the express image. I love that because what I think it did for me immediately was I immediately connected to Heavenly Father. And I was reminded that that is such a significant role that Jesus played through his whole mortal ministry, and now even beyond, is to connect us with our Heavenly Father, to help us with our identity, to understand who our Heavenly Father really is. And all we have to do is just look at him. So I love that title of the express image. And those are found in chapter one. And then of course, in verse six, it talks a little bit about the first begotten, the only begotten, we've heard that, but look at verse eight, I was amazed at this, that it says right there the throne, oh, God is forever and ever a scepter of righteousness. I thought, ah, sector. And so what did I do? I went to the Google and summon, and I said, Oh, scepter is authority. And so I've never heard him have that title of scepter of righteousness. I love that. Oh, I was so amazed that everything that we do, should all we have to do is just look at Jesus and see the radiance of God's glory. And the I love the phrase that I read, exact imprint of God's nature. Oh, wow. I know. Aren't those beautiful? I wish I could say I made those up. But I was watching a little video clip called What is it CD, the Bible project?
Tammy Uzelac Hall 18:26
Oh, man, love the Bible project on YouTube.
DeeDee Abaroa 18:29
That yeah, radiance of God's glory and exact imprint of God's nature.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 18:36
Hold on, I gotta write that down. I think verses one through three totally teach us that.
DeeDee Abaroa 18:42
Doesn't that just immediately connect you to our father is and I get a little I get a little emotional when I talk about our Heavenly Father, because Jesus has helped me to make a direct connection with our father. And when I pray, I feel him. I feel His love profoundly. There's that word again. And I think because it is so profound to me, I think it's because we live in a day and age with the profound problems. And I hear from sisters all over, who are just hurting and having habits that are just hurtful for them and for themselves. And it's a lot of it's because they're not really understanding. I believe that they have a father in heaven, who adores them, who absolutely cherishes them. And Jesus does that. He's the one who connects us to him. That's what his job is to do.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 19:47
Maybe Thank you. Thank you. Wow. You could feel it as you said it. I felt those the truth of those words. Thank you. But did you find Steve?
Steve Abaroa 19:58
Well, I do Okay, chapter two, we're in chapter two, in verse 16, he is called, or he has the title of the seed of Abraham. Because and it goes along with 17, the faithful High Priests. And if you recall that under Moses, the law of Moses, the High Priestess was someone who was from the, the tribe of Levi Aaron, and you had to have that kind of bloodline in there. But the Savior is not from that tribe, the Savior is from Judah. And so he's called the seed of Abraham, and he is the faithful high priest or the high priest silver all. But I think the the, the one title that we had both is there's one that's in six that will say for very last, but the one and verse 10, DeeDee and I just absolutely love this one, the captain of our salvation. And I think this is just absolutely fantastic. If you understand the terms what captains do, when you have captains of teams, when you have different captains like like when I taught the ater, I didn't have a captain over production, but they had a stage manager who was the captain. They're the ones who took what I said, and made sure that everyone understood it. And everyone followed those directions that I had laid forth. And they sat there and they would write all the notes, and they would make sure that everyone understood them. And so like, if I was doing something else, I was over there in the costume or something, the stage manager would make sure that everyone was one. And they understood. And so that is what the Savior, He is our captain. He has taken all the information from our Heavenly Father. And He makes sure that we are one that we are following the what our Heavenly Father wants us to follow. And he unifies us, he's there to encourage us, the stage manager there sit there, if you forget the lines, they'll feature that line. And that's what the Savior does that if you're forgetting he'll need that to you. And so he's right there. He is the captain of our salvation.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 22:31
Steve, let me ask you this question. And DeeDee. I'd love to know your response for this. So going to verse 10. I'm so grateful you found that title. It's one of my favorite titles as well. I think it's awesome. Let's read the verse DeeDee. Will you read verse 10? For us?
DeeDee Abaroa 22:45
Absolutely. For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation, perfect, through sufferings.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 23:03
Now, those of you you've just beautifully Steve taught us about the role of a director and you've connected it to a captain. I want to know this. At the end of that verse, it says, perfect through sufferings, now the captain of our salvation perfect through sufferings. What is the benefit of having a captain who's had to suffer? Why does he have to suffer?
DeeDee Abaroa 23:28
I'll jump in on that one, I. And I think that's partly my favorite part of that whole verse, just not only just captain of their salvation, but perfected or perfect through sufferings, that the captain gets what even the lowest of the seamen have to do, or the lowest of the team members have to do, he gets it, he understands or she understands. But in this case, Jesus knows exactly, exactly the intimate hurts that we are dealing with, or the loneliness that is, is plaguing us. And so if I know that my captain knows exactly what that is, and what it feels like, Oh, I am so much more willing to listen to him. I am so much more willing to take and heed and hearken to his counsel.
Steve Abaroa 24:23
You know, one of the things you have more respect for a captain who has been on your level when in like the fall teams and things like that, you just don't walk on and become a captain. But you started out below, and you worked your way up, worked your way up, worked your way up. And I think a lot of times I know that a lot of my students had more respect for the stage managers when they were actually actors at one time. And so they understood that and we we kind of joke that If you knew the acting and the technical part, then that really made you close, closer to everyone because you understood everything. And so to be this, this captain, as mentioned in there, prior to that, Paul was talking to the the keepers and said, Okay, you keep saying there's angels brought the law to us. But here you have Christ, who became more than that he lowered himself. And he became mortal. And he went through all of this. Everything, all the suffering, all the pain, and, and temptations, so that he could become that Captain of our salvation, He has all that experience. And so he knows exactly what you're going through. So, again, at the beginning of that chapter, he says, Hear him, and don't fall away.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 26:02
You know, I'm wondering, do either one of you have an experience, where you really had to trust in that verse, and experience where you're like, I don't know how this is gonna work out. But Jesus said, This is how we're supposed to do it, or where you had to count on the fact that he did suffer, and he understood your suffering.
Steve Abaroa 26:20
There's something that that has kind of come across a couple of times as we're reading this, and asked, sometimes it just makes me so emotional. We had three sons. We had three sons, and our last our number three son, he, he came to us a little early, he was almost two months early, do something like that. Yes. And at that point, the doctor said, Okay, you cannot have any more children cannot it's just not. It's dangerous if you have any more children. Okay, so we said, okay, there wouldn't be that three, with three, three kids. That's three boys. That'd be fine. Good. Yeah. But but somehow there was always something within my mind. That no, there needed to be one more. And I just had to have faith in that, that there wouldn't be one more child, one more child, and all the three boys, their middle names all have something to do with a family line that that comes in. And so one family line wasn't wasn't missing. And it was one of those things where I kept getting these impressions that there was one more but it was like, but how can that possibly be? The Savior knows more than I do, and just have to have these feelings. And then we had gone to San Diego for a funeral of our favorite dance. And during that my sister from North Carolina, had come to us and she asked, she goes, have you ever thought about adoption? And we just kind of looked at each other and said, Well, no, not really. And she goes, Well, think about it, because there's a little boy waiting for you in North Carolina. And we had found out that my niece was with child and she had told my sister that we were two of the ones that needed to have this baby to take care of his baby. And so the funny thing about that is during the funeral, DeeDee and I kept talking about this. And suddenly I saw my sister standing up there, they were waiting for DeeDee to come up and play the piano. We totally forgot. And so she had to run up there. But as we came home, the six hour drive back to Arizona, we kept talking about this. They kept saying, Well, can we do this? Can we do this and then as we got near our house, we were to turn left to our house but we turn right we would go to the Archbishop's house. And our bishop was a lawyer and so we turned right and went right to him. And the first thing he said was you need to go the temple. And so we went to the temple. And just prior to that DeeDee sister said, listen to this small voice. There won't be thunder, lightning, just listen to the small voice. And just as the session was about to begin, I know this EDIS head is like trying to get my attention and she kept pointing to the officiator and the officiator. His his nametag it was like Red Pop sname so a new bright pen. Yes, this was the son, our last son, who was to come to us, this just came from a different way. And so we had six weeks to get the adoption done more miracles than you can think of happened during that time to get that all taken care of. But we, we, our family is complete. And it was just relying on the faith of a savior that he knew. Things don't always work out. Just have faith. I'm the captain here. And that will work out for you.
DeeDee Abaroa 30:47
Wow, Stevie, I'm glad you brought that up. Because I, I felt the Spirit so strongly as as he was sharing our story of our fourth boy. And he is such an incredible gift to our family. He really was the bow on the package. But I wanted to add one quick thing. And I think this is what I had been thinking about. As we read that scripture is I, I was a school teacher for 35 years. And I knew that being a working mother was going to be a challenge no matter what. And even from the beginning, choosing to be a working mom is kind of tricky in our culture, at least it used to be. And there were a lots of judgments made sometimes about working mothers, and they shouldn't be in the home. But we just couldn't make it work financially. And I had the degree, I had the I had a love for teaching. And so we just kept powering through. And I thought, if we adopt one more, that's going to be one more little baby that I'm going to have to take and put into a care, which kills my heart. And I didn't know if I could do it yet again. All of our boys had gone through that. And they were now school age. So here was all of our children, school aged ages. And now we're going to take on yet another little baby. And I thought I'm gonna have to take him and put him in daycare, should I stay home, we couldn't figure out how to make all of it happen. I'm telling you, that was a direct answer to our prayers. And the captain of our salvation knew. He knew what the next play was going to be. He knew exactly what our family needed. And he is such a sweet blessing for all of us. We love them all. We love them all. They're good men. Wow.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 32:46
Okay, well, and what I got from your experience is that you trusted in your captain, and you didn't know how it's gonna work out. But you believed that Jesus knew. And you trusted in that. I mean, that seems like that was the theme of your whole story, you leaned into this idea that he is the captain, our captain who is familiar with sufferings and storms. And you know, Steve, as you said so many times before he knows how to stay in the boat. So gosh, thank you so much for sharing your testimony about that. So then what we get to do in the next segment, is we're gonna discuss another crucial role that the Savior plays in all of our lives, and how it's going to help us become exactly what he knows we need to become and it has to do with building homes. We'll talk about that next.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 33:39
Okay, you two have you guys ever had to build a house? Or can you tell me any ideas? What goes into building a house? Why do you laugh?
Steve Abaroa 33:47
Because we have built three? Oh, I didn't know that. Three houses? Well, you know, we didn't actually build them ourselves. But you know, gone through the process. We did a townhouse and then a multi storey house and then finally the house that we're in now. Oh, wow. Yes, it it's, it's scary. It's scary financially. It's scary. Just to watch it happen to keep going over there and making sure that everything is going okay. It's scary. To build a house.
DeeDee Abaroa 34:21
I gotta tell you the funniest story, the very first home that we ever decided we're gonna we're gonna do this. And we were just young parents and we had two little boys and, and we're school teachers. So we're pinching the pennies. And we're, we're really dotting the I's and crossing the t's to make sure everything works out. And we don't overextend ourselves. And it was a townhome. Now mind you, we didn't we didn't care. It was going to be a home that we could call our own. And we invited my siblings over when the when the cement when the foundation was going to be laid. Oh, it was going to be so grand And sure enough, we're standing there as the cement truck pulls up. Now again, this is a townhome. So we're expecting this massive layout of concrete over the rebar. Oh my goodness, I was heartsick. When I realized that foundation is as big as a rug that says bit. That's what we're buying. I was, I was a little bit heartsick thinking we just signed on. And that's the size of our foundation. What are we going to do? We're not going to all fit in there. What are what have we done?
Tammy Uzelac Hall 35:39
Well, and I hear I've never built anything. We've we have remodeled the basement before. And people would always say, Listen, nothing challenges a marriage more than building a house together and choosing things. Like it's not for the faint of heart. Would you agree? Oh, oh,
DeeDee Abaroa 35:55
oh, honey. That is when you literally put that you put that relationship through the ringer on the app.
Steve Abaroa 36:04
Oh, great. Good to the Design Center. And why am I here? First.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 36:11
Oh, that's so fantastic. All right. Well, I want us to be thinking about this idea of building a house and having houses because it has everything to do with Hebrews chapter three verses one through six. In fact, just look through those verses and highlight every time you see the word house, you're going to see it quite a bit. Because the Savior uses a metaphor of a house to teach us an important principle. So we have the word in verse two. And we'll just gonna we'll just start by reading and Steve, can you please read verse, verse one and two,
Steve Abaroa 36:41
Hebrews three, verse one into wherefore Lee brethren rotators of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priests of our profession, Christ Jesus.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 36:54
Okay, real quick. I just want everyone to highlight right there, High Priest of our profession, there's another title for Jesus, high priest is super important. You're going to see it so much throughout the rest of these chapters. So every time you see high priest market, but we're not going to talk about it in depth today. We're actually gonna talk about it next week, because you'll see that title again next week. So just kind of put that in the back of your brain. High Priests is the title. Steve did a great job telling us about it in the last segment, and we have it here again. Okay, go on. Steve read the next verse for us.
Steve Abaroa 37:25
Okay, verse two, who was faithful to Him that appointed him as also Moses was faithful to all his house.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 37:34
Okay, there we go. So we have right here this idea Moses was faithful in all his house, okay, we have a house here. Now we have verse three and four DeeDee, will you read that for us.
DeeDee Abaroa 37:43
Sure. Verse three, and four, for this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, in as much as he who had to build did the House have more honor than the house? For every house is builded by some man, but he that built all things is God.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 38:05
Okay, now got this idea. We're thinking about building a house. What are we trying to learn here? So Paul is using this as a comparison between Moses and Christ, and he's pointing the reader to Jesus, making Christ greater than Moses. That's what he's trying to teach the people because everybody loved Moses. At this time, Moses is the head prophet. So remember, we're trying to convince people of Jesus. And so Paul is using this idea of a house like Moses had a house, which was the children of Israel that he was in charge of, but now we have I love for it and I love the way you read it DeeDee, for every house is builded by some man, but he that built all things as God. So now we're kind of shifting the way we think things Okay, wait a minute, we're still talking about houses though. Verse five. And Moses barely was faithful in all his house as a servant, for a testimony of those things, which were to be spoken after. And then we have verse 60, we read that force,
Steve Abaroa 39:00
but Christ as a son over his own house, whose house we are, if we hold bested that confidence, and the rejoicing of the hope, berm and to the end.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 39:14
So Paul is teaching Listen, we know you love Moses and his house, the law of Moses the way they live things, but we aren't going to live in that house anymore. In fact, we're going to demolish that house. We're going to not we're not even going to renovate it. We are going to just demolish it to the ground. And we're going to live in a new house. And that is what verse six is teaching us but Christ as a son over his own house, whose house we are or whose house we belong to. That's the house that matters from here on out. Now the people who are hearing this that was so hard to hear, what are Wha What are you talking about? Like no, we we keep the Law of Moses. We've been doing it for centuries. The Law of Moses is what we believe. And Paul is just trying to subtly say, I know and there's such a better how As you could belong to, and I think sometimes in our own lives, we even struggle with verse six. So many of us have our own personal houses, right? And we've built this house, and then something comes along. That's maybe new because we're living in the restoration. And we might go, No, I don't like the way that is, I didn't want that in my house. Like, that's not where the refrigerator goes, we've always planned for the refrigerator to go right here, right. And I think so many of us in our minds have the fridge going in this certain spot. And then what Paul's saying is, that's true, and it could go there. But we're in Christ's house. And this is where Christ now wants the fridge. And this is what Christ needs it to look like. And that's uncomfortable, right? We don't like change, do we, as humans, we are comfy in our home with our blankets and our couch where everything has been.
DeeDee Abaroa 40:49
We are creatures of habit, aren't we? And even as we are now this many years beyond the pandemic, and the world shut down, and President Nelson was was giving even before that, giving us the new adjustments, I would hear some some murmur, sputter and meta that oh, what is this all about? I can't do it this way. We got I mean, it would have been as if we go into a chapel and sit in a different pew. If we sit in a different view, ruffle some feathers there. But I, I am with you. I love how Paul is trying to help them to just shift have a little bit more of a long view. Look at the bigger picture, there's a much bigger picture. So and I love how President Nelson has taught us, we got to stop being so myopic. I love this word. Hold fast, the confidence, I love that confidence, and the rejoicing of the hope firm and to the end. So as we embrace these adjustments that were given, and as we're living in a living church, in the restoration, and as we receive new revelation and new practices, that we embrace that knowing that this is all building us, in the bigger house, the bigger plan the bigger vision.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 42:18
Well, thank you, DeeDee. Because as you're reading that I looked over at Verse seven, and eight and how much do we love this where Paul says, Wherefore, as the Holy Ghost saith today, if you will hear His voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation in the days of intimidation in the wilderness, like don't harden your hearts. Just soften your hearts. Don't be like the children of Israel, were in the wilderness. Like, just accept what I'm saying. And believe please leave. I like how you started this out, Steve, get back in the boat. Come on, it's not worth it to jump out. Let's all just do this together. Let's build this house together. And it's okay, so we so we need a new area where we're gonna put the fridge All right, we'll figure it out. And I think that's what the Lord's asking us to do with this idea of a house. And we've used this quote before, but I think it's just so fitting. It's a CS Lewis quote, we're gonna read this. And here's what he asked to teach us about houses and I'd love to know your perspective on living the gospel of Jesus Christ and this quote from CS Lewis, DeeDee, can you read this quote for us?
DeeDee Abaroa 43:12
i So Will, it says, imagine yourself as a living house, God comes in to rebuild that house. At first perhaps you can understand what he is doing. He is getting the drains, right and stopping leaks in the roof, and so on. You knew that those jobs needed doing and so you are not surprised. But presently, he starts knocking the house about in a way that hurts and does not seem to make sense. What on earth is he up to? The explanation is that he is building quite a different house from the one you thought of throwing out a new wing here putting on an extra floor they're reading up towers making courtyards. You thought you were going to be made into a decent little cottage, but he is building a palace. He intends to come and live in it himself.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 44:10
Tell me why that made you emotional.
DeeDee Abaroa 44:13
I you know what I've heard this reference many times. But as I feel the spirit so strongly right now, I think it is again just a reminder to me that I need to just trust QTSS. I just need to QTSS that's kind of my little mantra that Steve taught me. What does it mean? It stands for quietly trust and silently serve just QTSS. That's his kind of his little code language. I want you to know to me to kind of stop spinning stop toiling don't worry just get yourself but back to put yourself back in the boat and just trust. So Q. T. S. S. just quietly trust and know that He is building so Something beyond imagination for me. If I'll just silently serve and quietly trust
Tammy Uzelac Hall 45:07
QTSS quietly trust and silently serve. Isn't that even the answer to all of this?
DeeDee Abaroa 45:14
I think it is. Yeah. Steve says that's the answer for all my worries. Yeah,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 45:22
but I think it's awesome.
Steve Abaroa 45:24
That that kind of came to us. When our last son, he had done it all himself to go to BYU Idaho. But on the day that he was to leave it, nothing was going right. Everything was going in. And for if you knew our leader, our fourth son, he's just this quiet example of goodness. Well, he wasn't that day. And I remember coming out of the garage, and I seen a box that he was trying to pack in the car fly across the street. And so of course, you know, DeeDee was kind of getting Oh, no, oh, no. And so it just came out. Q t, quiet, quietly trust. And it worked out. And we just ended it did it all worked out. He's still our, you know, charming son. But it was it was a rough time. But it was just quietly trust.
DeeDee Abaroa 46:25
And he, and he is a silent servant. He's very, very quiet about his service and his love. And I love when I'm around other sisters and I and my colleagues, and when I'm around other family members in my ward, family and steak family, and even in our neighborhoods, when I see the silent servants, oh, I'm just drawn to them. I'm just drawn, that they're not about themselves. They're just about service. And so then QTSS kind of became my new mantra that that's what I try to emulate. Just Just stop spinning. Stop worrying. Stop toiling over the insignificant, just quietly, trust our Savior, and just silently serve him.
Steve Abaroa 47:07
Which I think is what Paul is trying to tell us. You know, just yeah, let it let it happen. Let this go on. It's kind of like when we went from home teaching to ministering, just let this happen. And you're gonna see marvelous things. And he's telling that the saints there, just let this happen. Let this happen and you're gonna see marvelous things. So quietly, trust
Tammy Uzelac Hall 47:34
silently serve, which is the exact opposite of what you want to do when your house is being demolished. You want to scream and yell and put things back like it's it's just the most beautiful mantra that we all could absolutely benefit from doing and I I'm so grateful that you just taught us that so thank you so much because it blends perfectly into our next segment. Because if we are cutie assessing if we're quietly trusting and silently serving, then this next thing Paul teaches will just come naturally we'll talk about that next
Tammy Uzelac Hall 48:15
Okay, so we talked at the beginning that you guys are nonstop you're go go go go go. But I did not know this about you DeeDee that you'd like to take a nap. Why do you nap everyday? Tell me about that.
DeeDee Abaroa 48:25
Well, I will tell you, as a school teacher, you're on your feet you're going and you you do not stop. It is from sunup to beyond sundown work. And I always just hungered every day after eating lunch for the Okay, teachers out there, they'll appreciate this. Okay, maybe the 10 minute lunch break that you get. And I would just hunger for just a little nap. And then stevia again taught me about PK 21 He was you need a PK 20. And I know my I said, Well, what's a PK? 20? And he said, Well, President Kimball always believed in a 20 minute nap. And I'm like, Oh my gosh, that's so awesome. I want to do that. But now my PK 20s are like PK 120 Is there
Tammy Uzelac Hall 49:18
because you can because I
Steve Abaroa 49:20
can. On my mission in Indiana. It was 76 and 78 are my first mission president Keith W. Wilcox used to talk about that and used to tell us you know, if you have a really intense day, it's okay to take a PK 20 Just make sure that the K 20 Just the president can build a 20 minute nap. Then it gets you going for the rest of the day. So I was we always cut each other out cipher a PK 20
Tammy Uzelac Hall 49:52
That is so cute. Well, and I'm struck with this because it's acronym that they you know, the QTSS-ing. The quiet lightly trusting and silently serving, you're going to definitely need a PK 20 You're going to need a little nap. But what I think is really significant is the Lord uses a word that's connected to this idea of a nap and Hebrews chapter four, if you are quietly trusting and silently serving, you are going to need this. Look at verse three. In Hebrews chapter four verses three through 11, there was one word repeated several times, did you notice what it was just curious.
DeeDee Abaroa 50:28
Love that word, but rest, your rest,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 50:33
you're gonna need a rest. Now this is so awesome because this word is repeated often. Let's just read a couple of these verses. Steve, can you read verse three and four for us?
Steve Abaroa 50:45
Sure. Verse three and four are We which have believed do enter unto rest, as he said, as I have sworn in my wrap it be shall enter into My rest, although the work were finished from the foundations of the world, for he that spake in a certain place of the seventh day on the wise, and God did rest on the seventh day from all his work.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 51:15
Now DeeDee read verse five for us.
DeeDee Abaroa 51:17
And in this place, again, if they shall enter into My rest.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 51:24
Now, look down at the footnote below for five a we have a Joseph Smith translation. So I like to circle the little a five and draw a line down to five A we read the Joseph Smith translation, the correct translation of this verse,
DeeDee Abaroa 51:36
yes. Hebrew for five Joseph Smith translation, and in this place again, if they harden not their hearts, they shall enter into my wrist.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 51:52
Tell me why do you love that? Well,
DeeDee Abaroa 51:54
I love hearts. Anyway, I love every time I read the word hearts, but I love the fact that the what we're getting from the jst is, is kind of an if then, if they harden not their hearts, then they shall enter into My rest. I love that. I love the fact that, that as we talk about the Sabbath day as a day of rest and being at rest with him, I love learning. I think it may have even been from you, Tammy that helped me to have the aha moment of with God. That, and I've never Well, I remember early on and I've been in leadership roles many times. And I thought the day of rest is not a day of napping. That is not a day of rest.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 52:42
It is can I get a hallelujah? Every one of us listening. You're like there's nothing restful about a Sunday sometimes as a member of this church
DeeDee Abaroa 52:50
as young parents, especially leader
Steve Abaroa 52:52
Oh, yeah. Okay. Sometimes DeeDee is gone from six in the morning. And then I probably won't see her until two or three in the afternoon when she's, you know, having to visit boards. State correlation she meets with the state presidency, twice a month, her presidency and his presidency. So yeah, she's, it's not a day of rest for her.
DeeDee Abaroa 53:18
But I love learning that is I do and engage and participate fully. And I don't harden my heart. Because I can Burma, I'm all right, my darling, I have to tell you, I have a tendency of murmuring like no tomorrow. And so when I stopped doing that I QTSS and just harden, not my heart, and realize all of this is to build the kingdom. It's all about him. And when I remember that perspective, and soften my heart, soften my thoughts and put my vision where it really needs to be, and put Jesus Christ as the centerpiece of everything I do. Then it is incredible. The rest that I receive. Wow.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 54:06
Well, thank you for sharing your thoughts and your your opinions about this. Because here's what's neat when you read verse five, and I laughed at this because I thought, listen, I I'm not going to harden my heart to take a nap, like, it makes me laugh like is that we're talking about because there's no hard heart there, I will easily rest. But I think it's significant. And you both have really hit the nail on the head with this because it says if they harden up their hearts, they shall enter into My rest. And that word rest is really significant. As members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we are going to define that word. If you go to verse eight, nine and 10, the word rest appears again. So just go ahead and highlight rest where you see those verses. And let's define what exactly is God's rest. So we have a great quote. This is from elder W. Craig Zwick. It's from the February ensign of 2012. I and his talk is called entering into God's rest. And here's what he has to teach us about this. And Steve, can you read this quote
Steve Abaroa 55:07
from this, we understand that in this life, the rest of the Lord comes as we increase our knowledge of and faith in the reality of Jesus Christ, even to the assurance that he lives and loves us, the rest of the Lord in eternity is entering into the presence of the Lord.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 55:30
Okay, so we have two definitions for rest. Now, brothers wick is actually quoting, a very long quote from John a widow, Joseph F. Smith, about what the rest of the Lord is. So we have this in our show notes, and I'm asking my guests to follow along with me, in this quote, and what I want you to do is, tell me what stands out to you as I read this, the ancient prophets speak of entering into God's rest. So what exactly does this mean? Well, to my mind, it means entering into the knowledge and love of God, having faith in His purpose and in his plan, to such an extent that we know we are right, and that we are not hunting for something else. And we're not disturbed by every wind of doctrine, or by the cunning and craftiness of men, who lie in wait to deceive. We know of the doctrine that it is of God. And we do not ask any questions of anybody about it. They are welcome to their opinions, to their ideas, and to their vagaries. The man who has reached that degree of faith in God, that all doubt and fear have been cast from him, has entered into God's rest. And he need not fear the vagaries of men nor their cunning and craftiness, by which they seek to deceive and mislead him from the truth. Then he goes on to say this, I pray that we may all enter into God's rest, rest from doubt, from fear from apprehension of danger, rest from the religious turmoil of the world, from the cry that is going forth here and there, low. Here is Christ low, there is Christ low, he's in the desert coming out to meet him. The man who has found God's rest will not be disturbed by these vagaries of men. For the Lord has told him and does tell us, going out out to seek them, going out out to hunt them. For when Christ shall come, he will come with the army of Heaven with Him in the clouds of glory, and all eyes shall see Him. We do not need to be hunting for Christ here or Christ. There are prophets here and prophets there. That is the definition of God's rest. I'm curious what stood out to you from this definition?
Steve Abaroa 57:37
Wow. Wow, that that's a wow, one. One of the things that, that I think I always need, and a lot of people need is right there where it says, a rest from doubt, from fear, from apprehension, event, danger. I mean, we there is so much doubt and fear in the world, and we have so much doubt and fear in our lives. And there's so many times that that that fear that that doubt like Am I really a son of God? Am I really this, Am I really that, to really embrace Christ, it's gone. You don't have that doubt, or that fear anymore. And I think a lot of times, you know, that's still something a battle that people still have to try to, to overcome. Because Satan puts that into us so many times. A small thing might not go right and this just like, Ah, I have failed, that there's just this that, you know, and, and is something that we really need to to really look for. And I really love that, that that is the rest. The rest is from all of those things that just tear us down. And when we have embraced Christ, we can rest from those fears and those doubts.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 59:11
Like he said that when we, when we embrace Christ, we can rest. That's beautiful. Steve, what about you, DeeDee?
DeeDee Abaroa 59:18
I was so just struck with such light. When it says, To my mind, it means entering into the knowledge and love of God, having faith in His purpose and in his plan. I love that I love the simplicity of that entering into the knowledge and I was taken immediately when I heard your voice reading that is that we are promised, we are promised with the greatest of love, the gift of discernment. And when we are given that gift of discernment to really understand and not be blown in the winds of society. At and not having to, to worry and a spin and toil as I oftentimes do, and I become fearful, and I lose confidence, spiritual confidence, I just know that I have been promised that the knowledge and the love of God are mine, if I will just have the faith and his purpose and plan. I love the promises of the initiatory in the temple, and I love to go and be reminded of that daily. And I think when we were, when we were ordinance workers in the Gilbert temple, I loved the language of that we would speak in the initiatory. And as I would look into those beautiful eyes of those patron women, I almost wanted to take my, my hands and put them around their face. And just say, listen, listen, listen, these are so real, I can testify that when we really do put our focus on Him, that and understand the purpose, and maybe even not even understanding the purpose. And I think that's where so many of, of our, our faith community and many outside the faith community are just spinning, without even being tethered. To understanding that there is if we just come to his rest, enter into the knowledge and love of God.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:01:26
Beautiful, both of you, your comments are so spot on. In fact, now it gives whole new meaning to this idea of hey, be sure to rest. Everybody makes sure to rest. Now our PK 20 is also going to be like, an enter into the knowledge and love of God, learn about him, lean into Him, trust Him as the captain of your salvation, all of this, because here's what's really cool when we can enter into His rest, and ultimately, the ultimate rest will be salvation, to live with him again, that will be the best rest ever. But right now we have the ability to enter into His rest into the knowledge and love of God. And so in the next segment, I'm going to show you in Scripture, one of the greatest blessings that can come from entering into his rest. And we'll do that next.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:02:21
I'm excited for this discussion. Because DeeDee you actually alluded to it a little bit earlier, when before we started recording, you said I'm going to be bold. And you knew what you were talking about, didn't you?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:02:33
I did because that word has so been with me all through this study of these chapters.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:02:40
Okay, so we just have to go to the verse of scripture that talks about it. Turn to Hebrews, chapter four, verse 16. And I really appreciate that the scholars I study with and Ogden Skinner, they said that this verse of scripture might be the greatest promise of the New Testament for obtaining help. Let's just sit with that for a minute. We're about to read the greatest promise of the New Testament for obtaining help. Are we ready for this? Okay, DeeDee. read Hebrews chapter four, verse 16.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:03:15
And can I read it super slow? Because I love this because yeah, I may I may even have to put on my drama voice because I love it so much.
Steve Abaroa 1:03:25
Please do your voice heard my voice,
DeeDee Abaroa 1:03:29
or my mother of sons voice? Oh, my can't wait. There we go. Hebrews four, verse 16. Let us therefore, come boldly, unto the throne of grace, that way may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need. Ah, love that.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:03:54
Why do you think they think Why do you think scholars are saying this is the greatest promise of the New Testament for obtaining help?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:04:02
Well, for me, that word boldly, is something that I I think I love it because I am not bold, or I find myself being just the opposite of bold. And I love when we're taught by our our general authorities, and especially our apostles, and our beloved prophet, we do not need to shun away from being bold and coming on to him and finding his grace. And I think because I do remember when we first moved from Provo to Arizona, I had been raised in Provo and, and all my friends were LDS and all of my teachers were LDS and we moved to Provo and I'll never forget the moment when a teacher, a co worker of mine, and we were sitting with our classes together, and she leaned over and she whispered, I hear that you are LDS Living I started to fill my heart palpitate. She said, now what is it that you truly believe? And I'm like, Oh my gosh, this is it. This is the moment. Oh, all my young women leaders, my parents, they've been telling me you better know those articles of faith, because it's. And so all of a sudden, I felt myself praying for boldness, to be able to stand tall and to be able to talk about Jesus Christ, and to tell her who I believe he is and to be a witness of him. And that she can also believe in Him. And so I was running through all I was running through all the articles of faith and trying to be ever so primary answer and Sunday school answer. And then finally, I just had this thought, come to me that just says, bury your testimony, and tell her what you believe. And I love this verse, because I think what it really does is it says, Come boldly to him. And he is going to be the answer for everything that you ever question. Any doubt that you have? He is the answer.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:06:06
Oh, okay. DeeDee. I'm so grateful you shared that story. Because I'm the same way. I'm super nervous. I mean, I'm not very bold. When I get on the airplane, don't talk to me. And I don't wanna talk about anything. Like, I get so nervous. My heart races too. But when we get to this verse of scripture, I want to know, how do we come boldly? How can you possibly tell me how you do it? How do you come boldly to our heavenly parents? And ask them for help, without sounding like a jerk? Without saying, Here's what you're going to do? Like, tell me about this verse? How do we really how have you done it? How do you come boldly to our heavenly parents? And asking for help? When you're in it, when it says right there for help in the time of need? How have you done that?
Steve Abaroa 1:06:49
You know, I think it's a relationship thing. What is your relationship to our Heavenly Father? I know, there are times that our sons will come to us and boldly ask, I need something. Because they know, they know our reactions, they have known us well enough that they know what we might say, you know, I know they were our oldest. And it just happened about a month ago, their air conditioning went out. And,
DeeDee Abaroa 1:07:29
and by the way, that's death of the desert desert. I
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:07:32
can't think of anything worse than your AC going out in Arizona in the summer. Thank you.
Steve Abaroa 1:07:37
And it was a hesitant, but it was a finally he just came right out. You know, he, our Bishop came right out and said, We need a place to stay. And it was like, of course she do. You of course can come because I think he he knows us. And he knows that we would give anything we could. To them. Our youngest came to us and said I need help. Every Saturday, I have an all day class and his wife. She works nights. And so it was like, of course, we will take our little grandson every Saturday. And yes, it's sacrifice grace. But of course, we'll do that because of that relationship. So if we have a really, if we can develop that really close relationship with our Heavenly Father, our heavenly parents, and with that savior, then we can both be go and say, I need help. You're here in here, you know, things that that they know, you really do need help it and I'm willing to give it because you have developed that relationship.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:08:54
In fact, Steve, what I'm hearing you say going back to what we just finished talking about last segment is if you have paid the price to enter into His rest, like, if you have rested, you've come to the knowledge and love of our heavenly Father, then you can boldly go and ask because your sons have done that with you. They have arrested in knowing how you operate. They know you, they know and i you i love how you just described everything you described as a beautiful assimilation to our Heavenly Father. Like I hope I can know My Heavenly Parents enough to know, this is how they'll react. Here's what I know I can ask them for and then I can boldly go and not be overbearing. I think that's the key is to boldly ask but not overbearing. And I love this idea that we will obtain mercy. Isn't that great in that verse? And you? You both are an example of your sons obtaining mercy from you. Yes. Come stay with us. Of course we'll watch your son. I think that's how our heavenly Heavenly Parents React to us. DT Go ahead.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:09:52
Well, I was gonna say and I Stevie I loved how you explain that, that that relationship with any relationship you've built Trust. And if and when we talk about coming boldly, in a time of need, we have to have that trusting relationship to understand that it's, it may not be what I want, it may be something completely different, it might go in a completely perpendicular direction, it might take a trajectory that I don't even understand. But I trust him, I trust him enough to ask him, and to help have him give me the help and plead for what I need at that time.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:10:35
So let's sum all this up, then we have a Savior, who is the scepter of righteousness, He is the captain of our salvation. And for those of us who take the time to rest, we will truly be able to come before the throne of God and boldly ask for help. And so in the next segment, in our last segment, then we are going to discuss what I think for me is one of the best promises of trusting in everything that we've talked about today. And so we'll do that next.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:11:14
Okay, so you to go back to the how we began this whole entire episode I had you clear your mind, I had you close your eyes. And think about that scenario. Describe for me what you imagined. What did the boat look like? What did your anchor look like? What was the storm like?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:11:29
Stevie? I can see it's right around the tip of your ears
Steve Abaroa 1:11:33
on the tip of my tongue that well, you know, growing up in San Diego, and my dad worked for the Navy, he worked for actually the Air Force part of the Navy. But we used to go out and see the big aircraft carriers, because they'd work on he was a mechanic and have worked on the swing. So we see those big aircraft carriers, and those were huge anchors that they would would drop and, and the reason above those anchors were just to be able to the ship, that ship may drift around, but it stayed in kind of one spot. And so it was just to stabilize them. And then storms when I was thinking about that and thinking of the storm coming. You just need to be able to have your ship stable. Yes, would rock up and down but it wouldn't drift off into other places. It would be stable, and it would stay right there. Yes, he would feel a little seasick or whatever. But it didn't go anywhere. It's stuck there. And so when we talk about anchors, were saying, Hey, we are anchored to this position. Yes, it's going to be stormy. But we're going to stick right here. We're going to stay right here. And we're not going to move.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:13:00
So awesome. I wrote so many notes. Okay. D describe it for me.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:13:07
I like that Stevie I wish I had grown up in San Diego. But I grew up in Provo, there was a Utah Lake right there. There you go. And, and there were all there are sometimes were some ferocious storms that would come through there. But with the boat, we did have a boat, we did have a boat. And as a matter of fact, that's what came to my mind was that when my dad and mom decided for wholesome family activities, let's get a boat. Well, the fun thing about that was all my older sisters and I have about 79 older sisters. And they were all gone. So it was just me and my younger brother. So it was great. When we would get on that boat, and as we would go up to either Deer Creek up in Oak Canyon, or we would go out to Utah Lake. We are better yet Lake Powell. We would literally have to when storms would come up. We try to make a run for the banks as fast as we could. Dad would full throttle ahead. Or we would just get the boat out of the stormy water so that we would seek refuge. Yeah, it was always a little scary because my job was to drive the boat onto the trailer. And if the winds had come up, and dad was right there and I don't know why my younger brother wasn't selected to do that job. That's I'm not bitter. But my job was to drive the boat up onto the trailer and we had a pretty good sized boat it was it was a good sized boat. And so to dry that in the storms in the winds in this oftentimes rains that we would get caught in it. It was a trick to be able to steer that boat after lifting the anchor and seek refuge and to be able to drive it in a way that you could get on to the trailer But the fun thing was is that oftentimes, and it would be my dad that would receive the boat. And he would then of course, crank it up to attach it to the trailer and secure it. I would sometimes that wind would just blow me right off course. And I would have to put it in reverse and slowly start to kind of wiggle it back and forth, either full, put the throttle forward or put it in reverse. And I think a lot of that happens to us spiritually, that as we try to seek refuge, sometimes we have to go into a little bit of a reverse mode and reset ourselves. Sometimes we have to put ourselves in direct alignment as best we can. And just trust that we're gonna get that boat up on that trailer. So when those storms would come up, now here in the desert, we have what's called her boobs, and we, they're, they're ferocious, they're actually kind of fun. But we seek refuge is similar in the same way and that we don't have to lift up anchors, but we have to secure we have to find security in whatever circumstance we find ourselves in. Because we know that storm is coming. Oh,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:16:12
great job. Both of you. Thank you for explaining that. I wrote down, we have to have security seeking refuge. Steven, like you said it stayed right where the boat was. It didn't mean it didn't kind of go around. And it wasn't Rocky, but it stayed right there. And all of your answers are perfect for this discussion. In Hebrews chapter six. Let's turn there. We're gonna learn about an anchor that we all need, and that we are encouraged to use throughout our lives when we come up into these really crazy tumultuous storms. Now for those of us going back to this discussion on resting for those of us who are resting and I think all of us are, we're becoming converted to the Savior. We're doing our best to keep our covenants we're holding callings. We're keeping covenants, you know and everything you guys have taught us the QTSS, were quietly trusting and silently serving. One of the things that we can count on is found in Hebrews chapter six. For those of you who are serving, there is an assurance and kind of a blessing. And I just love these two verses DeeDee, will you please read Hebrews chapter six, verse 10, and 11. And when you get to the word on righteous, let's just put unjust because that's the better Greek translation of that word for God is not unjust, because it makes the verse so much better.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:17:23
Okay, go ahead. I like that. And I'm reading. I'm reading verses 10. Oh,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:17:28
and 11 and 11.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:17:30
Oh, good. I was hoping you had asked me to read this one because this I have little stars and hearts all around this scripture. Oh, it spoke to my soul. Verse 10, of Hebrews six, for God is not unjust, to forget your work and labor of love, which he has shooed toward his name, and that you have ministered to the saints, and do minister. And we desire that every one of you do shoe, the same diligence, to the full assurance of Oh, unto the end.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:18:09
Why do you love that? Why do you have hearts and stars?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:18:13
Again, I think Paul wrote this, just for DeeDee Abaroa in 2023. I think he knew and I think obviously, I needed to know that when I am doing work, to build the kingdom to minister to get other sisters to see the vision of ministering that he is there he he won't forget that we're trying our best. And that all we have to do is put forth effort. And that I think to that when we when and it says in the verse which he has shooed toward his name. I love learning recently that the word shoe is to publicly proclaim, ooh, that's cool. And so when I shoe, or show or publicly proclaim toward his name, again, it refocuses me, and it really centers me on the why. Why am I doing this work? And why am I laboring in love? Oh, it is actually because I adore my savior. And I publicly proclaim His name. And all that I tried to do. And so when I stopped my my muttering and sputtering and murmuring, and I just know that he hasn't forgotten the work that I've been trying to do. I love that.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:19:38
Well, let me just tell you right now DeeDee I love it too. And here's why. As you were talking, I'm like, I believe that he sees DeeDee and I believe that he sees the work that DeeDee is doing. I mean, right now I am adding stars to that verse, and I'm putting your name next to it. So thank you for sharing your thoughts about that specific verse. You know, as you were speaking everything You said, goes perfectly back into this chapter because you described Abraham. Abraham didn't murmur. Abraham didn't complain. And that's the example that Paul then gives. He says, Look, God is aware of your efforts. And now let me tell you about another person that God was aware of. So go with me to Hebrews chapter six. And he says in verse 13, and 14 For when God made a promise to Abraham, because he could swear by no greater he swear by himself saying, Surely blessing I will bless thee and multiplying, I will multiply the so he's saying, The Lord POM promised Abraham such amazing, incredible blessings. And verse 15. And so after he had patiently endured, highlight that he obtained the promise, but the promise is interesting, because you think, oh, yeah, he had kids, he had a child when he was old. That was the promise, but cross reference the word promise to Doctrine and Covenants. So in your scriptures to the outside, just put Doctrine and Covenants, section 132, verse 29, he obtained the promise not until clear after death, the promise will be exaltation. Section 132 says he's received His exaltation, and he sitteth upon his throne, so he patiently endures, doesn't see the fulfillment of all the blessings in this life. But he did obtain the promise now, thinking about that in our own lives. We then go into verse 16, and 17, and 16, through 20 are such great verses, I'm going to teach it to you, I just want you to mark things as we go through it, you're ready to do this so fast Institute style, here we go. For men verily swear by the greater and an oath for confirmation is to them an end of all strife, he's talking about making all snap back in Scripture time, if you made an oath. It was your life is on the line. You never ever would swear by anything, unless you were really going to do it. So when we read the scriptures, Thou shalt not forswear thyself. We're not talking about swear words, we're talking about the Lord saying, do not make a covenant or commitment with anyone or anything that you're not going to follow through on. Then we have verse 17, wherein God willing more abundantly to shoe, there we go, that's awesome to publicly proclaim unto the heirs of promise, that's as the immune immutability of his council now highlight immutability, that means unable to change. So he's now setting this up. He's like, now listen, wherein God willing more abundantly to proclaim Unto us a promise that he cannot change of his counsel? And it's confirmed by an oath? Isn't that interesting? Is there anything we've entered into? That's confirmed by an oath? You bet. Look at verse 18, that by two immutable thing, so highlight the word to this, too, is that by the oath and covenant of unbreakable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, so we're learning right there. When God makes a promise with us, he cannot lie. We might have a strong constellation. I love the word constellation right here. The Greek definition is comfort, after a loss or disappointment. So the Lord is saying, Paul's teaching when we enter into a covenant with the Lord, an oath and a covenant of the priesthood. It's impossible for God to lie, that we might have strong comfort, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us. I mean, how many of us flee for refuge? Isn't that neat? You use that word, DeeDee seeking refuge in the storm. So so many of us in our storms right now. Just take heart, that the covenants you've made with our Heavenly Father, he cannot lie. He will offer you comfort, after loss or disappointment. And how will he do that? Oh, so pretty laying hold upon the hope set before us. Now look at 19 Steve, read verse maintain.
Steve Abaroa 1:23:58
Which hope we have an anchor of the soul, both sure and steadfast, and which endure it on to that within the veil,
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:24:11
highlight the first of 19, which hope we have as an anchor of the soul. Think back to that idea. And everything you guys said was so perfect. If hope is our anchor, it's going to keep us steady. It's going to keep us right where the Lord needs us to be. It's going to have us and and I thought it was interesting DeeDee because you said it was so tricky for you in that boat, like when you finally were able to steer your boat to safety. I liked that idea because it's tricky to have hope. It is tricky to trust in the covenants and promises with the Lord. But right here, Paul saying immutable, like it cannot be changed. The Lord will never change the particulars He'll never change the game. He'll never change the rules with oaths and covenants. What he says he will do He will do. And so our responsibility is for those of us who are fleeing for refuge, to just lay hold upon the hope set before us, and that hope is an anchor to our soul. I think that is such beautiful verbiage is powerful for me, because hope is a good thing. Sometimes Hope is the only thing right?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:25:24
It is. And you know, I love how you said that. That hope can be tricky. I, I am so grateful. You said that because one of the titles that I unofficially gave Christ in this chapter was the hope giver. And that if we step away from Him, if we become patterned to not go and partake of the sacrament and reset ourselves, as we drive our boats onto that trailer seeking refuge, we do that every Sunday, to be able to, to partake of the sacrament, we might have to repent, we might have to reverse a little bit we have to put ourselves back on course, but he it is tricky. And that's why we have the sacrament to remind us to get back on course to get in alignment. And that's that I believe, is so, so crucial for all of us to remember that we have to remember how significant the sacrament is. Because that's what's gonna give us our safety, our refuge and we can follow the camp, that anchor of our soul, find our anchor of the soul, and follow our captain is through those sacramental covenants
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:26:40
DBI will love that because the oath and covenant of the sacrament is we will keep the commandments we will take his name upon us, whatever name that is the name of the high priest the name of the captain of my salvation, we all the names we talked about, and we are promised to have His Spirit with us. Always, ah, odd. I love that course. We need the sacrament every Sunday, that is the reset.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:27:05
Beautiful, that is our reverse and our reset sorry, Stevie.
Steve Abaroa 1:27:09
And one thing in this verse that I think is so important, because if we have, if we have that hope, and we have used that as the anchor to our souls, it says in there that we then enter that within the veil. And it is so important because in the new language of the temple, we learn exactly what the veil is, and what the veil symbolizes. And when we have entered through the veil, we enter into that final rest of the celestial kingdom ever with our Heavenly Father. And it's important that we understand that what the veil means and what it is to us and I love the new language of the of the temple as it is explained to us and how it says it's right period in Hebrews. It's right there as we understand the veil is our Savior.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:28:10
Reverse 20 Steve Emery money. Okay, I'll hope to that right now is there it is what you just taught us
Steve Abaroa 1:28:17
whether the poor render is where as entered, even Jesus made and high priests forever after the order of Melchizedek.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:28:28
There it is. Yep, beautiful. Well, let's just finish with a quote from elder Faust. This is Elder Faust's classic talk, October 1999 General Conference titled, Hope, An Anchor of the Soul. And let's just read this DeeDee. Can you read this quote for us, please?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:28:48
Yes. President fow says Samuel smiles wrote, hope is like the sun, which as we journey towards it casts the shadow of our burden behind us. Hope sweetens the memory of experience as well loved, it tempers our troubles to our growth and our strength. It befriends us in dark hours excites us in bright ones, it lends promise to the future and purpose to the past. It turns discouragement, to determination. Hope is the anchor of our souls. I know of no one who is not in need of hope, young or old, strong or weak, rich or poor, as the prophet ether exhorted, Wherefore, whose sole belief in God might was surety hope for a better world. Yeah, even a place at the right hand of God, which hoped come with a faith make us an anchor to the souls of men, which would make them sure and steadfast always abounding and good works being led to glorify God that everybody in this life has their challenges and difficulties. That is part of our mortal test. The reason for some of these trials cannot be readily understood, except on the basis of faith and hope. Because there is often a larger purpose which we do not always understand. Peace comes through hope. Thank you. So good.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:30:27
So good. And so my last question is, and I want to just know is how can like when you read, I love how you read it DeeDee? Peace comes through hope, how can peace come through hope? Have you experienced that hope in your life?
DeeDee Abaroa 1:30:44
You know, I have, and I'm glad you asked that. Because it's sometimes as you mentioned earlier, it is the only thing we have, I have been so blessed abundantly. But there have been times of loneliness, there have been times of discouragement. And there have been times where I've questioned and I couldn't see beyond my own my own view. And if I just elevate myself a little higher, going to a little bit of a higher plane, that hope, just bring such comfort. And as a matter of fact, I loved a quote by Elder outdoor for it says, If you ever think that the gospel isn't working so well for you, I invite you to step back, look at your life from a higher plane and simplify your approach to discipleship. I think just lifting ourselves up to a higher plane, get a better view. And then that hope just gives us the warmth, the courage and the boldness to carry on.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:31:55
A man Oh, DeeDee, thank you. And I gotta tell you, like the timing of you sharing this is awesome, because that conference talk by Elder Dorf that really hit my heart, especially the part where it says simplify your approach to discipleship. Like, I needed to hear that right now. Thank you, DeeDee. That was awesome. This was a beautiful day. Wow. I loved our discussion. See, everyone's you can tell why these two I just Boyd Are you both? Okay. So do this. Just gather your thoughts? And what is your takeaway from today's discussion? What's something that struck you or that you learned? It's such a fun discussion.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:32:36
I gotta go right to the word rest. Now, again, I'm of Medicare age. So rest is kind of crucial. Whatever. I that was so invigorating to me to have that discussion again, about rest in the Lord and being one with him. And just being unified, connected, knitting our hearts together, to be at rest with him. And that if we can just find that rest, in in our covenants in our daily patterns in our patterns of living with our children, our grandchildren. And may I just put a plug in for ministry. Just go out there and find that rest with your ministering. And do it on that higher plane in that higher, holier way. I love learning from you on that. Thank you. Thank you.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:33:31
You're welcome. I love that you like rests, PK 2020 Be sure to rest That's our new quote, be sure to rest have you rested this week? You learned about Jesus? That's awesome. Steve, what about you?
Steve Abaroa 1:33:45
You know, there's so many and but trying to narrow it down, I think I still just have to embrace the anchor of our soul. That that is such a key take take away that for us to really understand who Christ is Christ is the anchor of our soul. He's there to keep a steady and to keep us in that firm spot if we can just embrace them and the things that we talked about the tape, partaking of the sacrament and then and and everything just stems on that, you know, the silent service and things like that is for us to really understand. The Christ is the anchor of our soul.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:34:32
Wow, Steven, as you were saying that it made me go back to what you taught us about the captain of our salvation and the director of shows because then I think if Hope is the anchor in this verse, Then you really do have to trust like Oh, I hope he is directing me in the right way. I hope this Captain knows how to man this boat. You know you have all these questions like I hope he knows where the light vests are at everything. So I hope he knows how to use the anchor. I'm grateful for that discussion. It gave me a new perspective on Captain and direction. So thank you. My takeaway for sure QTSS, quietly trust and silently serve. I have it right here my scriptures, I'm never going to forget it with your names because especially in light of what we were discussing, because no one thinks to quietly trust when you're building a home. Like you're in the thick of it and you're changing things in your making, like you said, you're going everyday to make sure they're doing what you're asking. And sometimes with family Father, we just need to quietly trust and silently serve that it will all be okay. Especially when we're in His service. So thank you for teaching me that. That was a great acronym. I love today. You guys are great.
DeeDee Abaroa 1:35:38
Tammy, you are a gift you are my take away because what you have taught me and listening to your podcast and being a contributor, just the little part that we were able to hopefully help with today. You are so gifted you go on road trips with this. You're in our living room with us. You've been all over the world with us, we make sure that we have our, our podcast going so that we can have the scriptures in you right there in our hearts. So we love you. Thank you. Thank you.
Tammy Uzelac Hall 1:36:07
I'm grateful that this podcast brought us together to be friends. So I just love you both. That's the benefit of the podcast, or the friends that I get. And I get you guys. So love you. We love you. Okay, well, how much do I want to know what you've learned from this episode? Oh my gosh, that was a great discussion. So if you're not following us on Facebook or Instagram, go do it. Because it's such a great place where you can just share what you've learned. You can also ask questions as you're studying throughout the week. And I try to answer anything I can during the week and then at the end of the week, we're going to post a question that comes from this episode. So comment on the post that relates to this lesson and share your answers and thoughts. You can get to our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday and go there anyway, it's where we're going to have links to all the references we used as well as a transcript of this whole discussion and we have a glue in for this episode, so go check it out. The Sunday on Monday Study Group is a desert bookshelf plus original brought to you by LDS Living. It's written and hosted by me Tammy Uzelac Hall and today our study group participants were DeeDee and Steve Abaroa and I love them. And you can find more information about my friends at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday. Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger it is edited and recorded and mixed by Cole Wissinger and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week. And please please remember to take time this week to rest because you are God's favorite.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai