The following transcript is intended to aid in your study. However, while we try to go through the transcript, our transcripts are primarily computer-generated and often contain errors. Please forgive the transcripts’ imperfections.

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Segment 1

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Have you ever sung the hymn 223 and then felt guilty or maybe rolled your eyes at that song? Look, this song is the anthem of being a latter day saint. It's the hymn. Have I done any Good in the World today? In fact, in the chorus, we sing, then wake up and do something more than dream of your mansion above doing good as a pleasure, a joy beyond measure, a blessing of duty and love.

Now, if you've ever questioned yourself and if you have in fact done any good in the world today, I have some exciting news. Because doctrine and covenant section 1 26 through 1 28 will convince you that not only have you done good in the world, but according to Joseph Smith, the good or even great cause that we are talking about.

Is the most glorious of all subjects belonging to the Everlasting Gospel. Welcome to the Sunday, on Monday Study Group, a Deseret Bookshelf plus original, brought to you by LDS Living, where we take the come Follow Me lesson for the week, and we really dig into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall.

Now, if you're new to our study group, please follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your come Follow Me study, just like my longtime listening friend Paula Rawlings in Spokane, Washington. Paula, you're gonna love today's episode, especially the guest.

Now, another awesome thing is my guest, because each week I get to have two of my friends join me, so it's always a little bit different. And today I'm so excited to introduce you to my very good friend, Holly Butterfield Rawlings, or as I call her HB, for the rest of the episode. Hi, hb. Howdy, old timer.

Been on many times. Long time guest, long time, long time guest. Yep. And Holly, this is exciting because. The guest we have today, you introduced us and her name is Diane Acevedo. Hello Diane. Hi Tammy. Listen, I don't have a lot of room to make friends, okay? Mm-hmm. I got a, mm-hmm. I got, I got my friends, I work full time, but the second I met Diane, I, all I could think was, I wanna be best friends with her.[00:02:00]

How do you two know each other? We work together. We used to work together. Mm-hmm. And it was, wow. I mean, we were sisters from another Mister, what did you think, Diane, when you met her? So I was the SVP of operations and Customer Experience, and I was interviewing Holly for a position in my department. And I remember just being so fascinated by her skillset and how vivacious her personality was.

And towards the end of the interview, we hugged each other. Of course you did. We'll be in contact and, and anyway, we ended up hiring her and she has and continues to create so much value for the organization and is probably one of the most talented writers and creative thinkers and critical thinkers that I've ever met.

So it's been a pleasure working with her, but also just a beautiful natural sisterhood that we have been able to build, uh, throughout the years. So it's been a fun journey. It, it really is a, like, it really is something that I treasure. Yeah. And I mean, I always tell Diane, she gave me wings to fly professionally.

And so we've had all these great professional connections, but the real root of it is in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Mm-hmm. And this woman, um, she's not messing around. She's, she's all in, she's a lifer. She's a lifer and I love her. This will be such a fun discussion because as I said to Diane earlier, HB has often said, you know, you really need to have my friend Diane on, and I have had Diane's name on my list for quite a while, and then when I got to these sections, I don't know why, but all of a sudden your name just popped into my head and hb, and then I'm like, let's do it.

So here we go. You guys ready for this? This is gonna be [00:04:00] fun. Yes, let's do it. These tend to be a little obscure sections. I mean, no one really ever spends time on section 1 26 and boy are we ever going to spend time. So it's gonna be a good discussion. So if you guys wanna know more about my guests, you can read their bios and see their pictures, which are going to be in our show notes, and you can find those at lds living.com/sunday on Monday.

So before I say my bit to grab your scriptures, I do have something very exciting to tell everybody. Hello. Dun, dun, dun, dun dun. In eight weeks we get to start studying the Old Testament. Let the countdown begin. Oh, I'm so excited. I feel like we made it, we've almost made it through the doctrine and covenants.

It's not my forte. It's, it's just, I'm sorry. Of course, I love all scripture, but I love the Old Testament, so I hope you guys are ready for some awesome Hebrew this next year anyway. I am, I'm gonna probably make a paper chain and put it in my closet, so yes, I love that. And b, she'll be on, because tell everybody what you've been doing the last couple weeks.

Well, I've been, uh, studying a little obscure language, not obscure, but I, I've been taking the Hebrew class with Don Perry on Wednesdays. Yes. And it is so fascinating. You get hooked, don't you? You do get hooked, Uhhuh. And I've got an app on my phone and I'm tracing the letters and I mean, I've got like seven of them memorized.

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah, I know, right? She's learning Hebrew. I can you, that's incredible. Oh, it's so, you know, the Bible, the Bible as it is translated, it's been a fair amount of time beating women up and uh, kind of misplacing them in the hierarchy. And when, you know, the Hebrew, um, then all the other things, like the proclamation of the family start to make sense because there's always been this like dissonance, cognitive dissonance between what we read in the King James version, but then when we know the Hebrew [00:06:00] boom.

How's that for a testimony of Hebrew? Yes, we're gonna promote more of Hebrew class. I think Don's gonna teach more Hebrew classes. Um, and then Don and I are doing a program together next year called Jesus Christ in Scriptures, finding Christ on Every Page. And you can watch that for free on YouTube in eight weeks.

Eight weeks. I'm so excited. And we're gonna talk about Hebrew and the Old Testament. Oh, it's so fun. Okay, well that has nothing to do with doctrine and cabinets. I just had to say that. Let the countdown begin. Okay. So everyone grab your scriptures and something to mark them with. And let's dig into doctrine and cabinets.

Sections 125 through 128. Here we go, U2. I just wanna know, first things first, what did the Holy Ghost teach you as you were reading these sections? In preparation for our discussion? I mean, as I read through it, um, my first thought process went to how important it is to teach within the walls of our own home.

Mm-hmm. And. Record things. Um, it, it, I, I don't wanna get ahead of myself. I wanna go through the scriptures first. Um, but it just reminded me recently I took a little sabbatical and it reminded me of a, a conversation that I had with great aunts and uncles and grandma in Puerto Rico about lack of recording.

Um, and the importance, like when it talked about baptisms for the dead, I am a convert to the church personally and none, no one in my dad's side of the family is a member on my mom's side of the family. My mom's mom and two aunts are members, but everyone else are non-members. And in my immediate family, I'm the only member of the church.

And so really knowing and learning about how important it is to do baptisms through the dead to allow others to have that opportunity, but to record it, I think the emphasis for me was the recording and witnessing mm-hmm. Of that. And I had an incredible conversation with. My family, my great grandmama [00:08:00] had 10 kids and I never, my, I'm 43 years old.

I did not know that there was 10 of 'em. I always thought there was only eight. They shared that back then they really wouldn't have a birth certificate or registration of birth until there were toddlers, until the census would come around, um, home by home to record how many people lived in the home. And that by that time, the sisters.

Got some type of, you know, sickness. And back then there was no resource to really care for them and heal them. I was like, well, what were their names? At what age did they die? And they're like, oh, we don't know. They were little, maybe one or two, and I don't know what their names were. And I'm like, what do you mean?

We don't know what their names were? Didn't talk about it like, they're my great grandmama. She's like, well, yes, when they, we were little, but then we really just, you just didn't talk about those things back then. And here I am gathering dates so that I can go and do baptism work for them. And I, it just felt so uneasy to know that here are two, two souls, two great aunts that I know nothing about, that I can't do work for.

Because even in the senses when I pull it, um, it, they don't appear. It's like they never existed. And so when I read, uh, especially 1, 1 27 and 1 28 about witnessing the baptism and recording the baptism and how important it was to keep track and record of that, it reminded me of that mo that conversation of where it's almost non-existent.

Their history, their little story of, or their presence in the family unit is non-existent, um, to everyone else. And so that was my first thought. [00:10:00] Oh, Diane, thank you for sharing that personal story. Yeah. And how important record keeping is we're gonna find, we're gonna find them, but there, there was nothing.

How do you find them? That's a real question. She's like, lemme, lemme, lemme tell you what I can do. We'll get to that later today. Yeah, yeah. We're, but thank you, you, that is a great, lemme dig into that. That's a great thing to start us out because we're gonna talk about that today in this episode. So I appreciate you sharing that story.

Awesome. I'm so glad that the Holy Ghost taught you that and spurred that discussion. That's so cool. Thank you. What about you Hb? I, I don't, it's like, I've never read this section, section 1 28 before I, it's, it's brand new every time I read it, but, you know, I haven't spent a lot of time in the doctrine covenants.

I think. I think that's why, but like this imagery of a welding link like that, that this work has to be done or the earth will fall apart structurally. Oh man. Will you put that verse for us? Yeah. It's verse 18 of section 1 28. And. I'll just kind of jump in. He said, it's sufficiently planned to suit my purpose.

As it stands, it is sufficient to know in this case that the earth will be smitten with a curse unless there is a welding link of some kind or other, between the fathers and the children upon some subject or other. And behold, what is that subject? It is the baptism for the dead. For we, without them cannot be made complete.

It says perfect, but I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I'm gonna take some liberties. Neither can they without us be made complete. Neither can they nor we be made complete without those who have died in the gospel also. So we often talk about, um, how we need to save the dead, but [00:12:00] we cannot be saved like they can't be, and we can't be made complete without.

Without them. Yeah. And so, and you think about that, I mean, wouldn't it be true like you think how close you are to some members of your family or your friends that you know right now? And heaven wouldn't be complete without them, but we lived this whole life before we got here. Mm-hmm. And some of those people were born 1700 years before we were some of our ancestors, you know, we, we would never have known.

I mean, Diane, maybe one or both of those missing ts were your best friends. And like, we would not be complete without them. Why did you take the liberty to change the word from perfect to complete? I don't use the word perfect anymore, ever in the scriptures. Well, it's a Hebrew, it's a hebrewism. Right. I know, I know that.

I, I know that you taught me that a long time ago, even before you were into the Hebrews. Yeah. And because I. That caused so much scrupulosity in me. Mm-hmm. This desire to have to be perfect. And it was literally like you took a billion pounds off my shoulders when you taught me. Oh, good. That perfect. In Hebrew means complete.

Complete or whole. Complete or whole. And so we don't have to be perfect. We're never gonna be perfect, but someday we'll be, you know, yeah. We can, we can strive to be complete with the Lord, but like someday we'll be complete with him. But all this nonsense about, you know, uh, having to be better and, and striving for perfection doesn't work for me.

And how incredible to think that the completion comes by way of family. Yeah. That's what makes us complete is each other. And so you understand why the family unit is so important within the church of [00:14:00] Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. We need each other. So, and let's just say, let's just say you have a strained relationship with one of your siblings or a parent, right?

Sure. I think many, many, many of us can, can identify with that some relationships will be healed in the next life. And so, oh, completion is eternal. Yeah, absolutely right? Yep. It's for sure not gonna be, my God, not gonna be finished in this life. We've got a lot of time to become complete or perfect, so, oh, thank you ladies.

Okay. This is such a good discussion. I mean, that's just what the Holy Ghost taught you. So we haven't even begun to study these sections and it's gonna be really fun. So in the next segment, we are gonna dive into section 126, which I don't think I've ever fully studied, but we have some new information and in light of that, it's gonna blow up Section 1 26.

I can't wait to show you what it is. We'll do that next.

Segment 2

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Let's go to Doctrine and Covenant section 126 real short. Holly, we read that for us. It's just three verses. You bet I will. Let's just, uh, pull her up here in the paper Scriptures. Nice. Can you hear that? Okay, dear and wildly beloved brother Brigham Young, barely, thus sayeth the Lord unto you, my servant Brigham.

It is no more required at your hand to leave your family as in times past for your offering is acceptable to me. I can hear his wife like cheering in the background and saying about time I have seen your labor and toil and ings for my name. I therefore command you to send my word abroad and take a special care of your family from this time.

Hence fourth them forever. Okay, Holly. Now this is fun because Holly was right when she said, I'm pretty sure that his wife was like, hallelujah. The long time coming. I had these two read an article before we [00:16:00] had this discussion because there is some information you need to have in order to fully appreciate Section 126.

So based on what you two read, tell me now how meaningful Section 1 26 is to you. I mean, Tammy, this kind of reminds me of the pioneer story we hear of John Moyle who had a wooden leg and would walk to Salt Lake from American Fork. Back. He would go and spend two weeks and he carved holiness to the Lord in the stone.

And then he would walk back. And of course, sister Royal's back at the, back at the farm with her 10 kids. And I always had a couple of questions about that. Number one, where was his home teacher to give him a ride? Why? Why is this guy trying to schlep his, his stone cutting stuff, you know? Yeah. 17 or whatever the, the number we, we do the temple walks and number two, um, I wanna hear the story of Sister Mole.

Amen. We're where she's farming by herself with, with 10 kids. I mean, she had to have been incredible. And when we read this story of Brigham Young was single, his wife had died and he married Maryanne Angel. She really was an angel. Mm-hmm. And we learned from reading this that she was an early convert to the Book of Mormon.

And she said that the spirit bore witness to her of the truth of its origin so strongly that she could never afterwards doubt it. And so, you know, she heads to Kurt Kirtland and must have been a testimony meeting. And, and Brigham said, who's that special sister? And um, and so they get married and then Brigham's gone for years and years [00:18:00] while she lives in squalor and abject poverty.

Let me just say this, this is a fun fact. She got married to Brigham Young for, it was her first marriage. She's 31 years old. He's got awesome. Same age as me. There you go. Hp. Yeah. 31. She marries Brigham. He's got two kids. 'cause his wife passed away. So now she's raising these two children. And I was shocked to learn that for the first five years of their marriage, he was gone for over half that time.

Serving missions like she was alone. Yeah. Raising these children. And as you read this article, it just gets worse and worse for Mary Angel. I started to get mad when I was reading this. No, I'm serious. Yeah. I was like, hello? Like, you know, can't they send somebody else? I mean she's, you know, she's rowing across the Missouri River to get some potatoes and rice and her baby's getting splashed by the icy water.

Yeah. And then rowing back so that they don't starve. And at the height seven children that she's taking care of. 'cause she's given birth to twins. She's got the two, she and three inherited. It's, it's chaos. It is, she's really behaving like a single mom. Right. Talk to me, Diane. Well, and that, but when I read this, I, I just, her story is of such grit and resilience and she's really leading mm-hmm.

Her home and her children and being the sort, as Brigham goes on these missions and I, I'm, I'm shocked that I haven't heard of this story before and that this hasn't been shared as, as much because she is caring and providing and. Raising kids as a single mom mostly. And that relates to me as a single mom wearing multiple hats.

The nurture, the [00:20:00] provider, the caretaker of constant fatigueness. And here to the bottom of the story of what Holly was sharing, it compares her, says many times she crossed the river to obtain the barest necessities of life, sometimes in storms that would have frightened women of ordinary courage. So she wasn't just a, an angel, she was a warrior.

Mm-hmm. Right. She was a constant doer. Someone that gave of herself and seemed like a little too much. When they reconnected, he was shocked to find her at the condition that she was in, um, because of, you know, how hard mm-hmm. Their current situation of living in poverty and the circumstances, but so she gave endlessly, she fought to provide and care for, and she did it with.

There is no, I mean, at least in the article, there is no complaints. Yeah. Like, I'm sure internally she was joyous to know that he was coming back and that he would be with them for a short period of time, but what a sacrifice. Mm-hmm. Well, and the, the part of the church history story, we've seen this video.

It's, and in seminary, I showed this video all the time. It's the story about Heber c Kimball and Brigham Young, pulling away from Hebrew's Nvu home in a wagon, and they stand up and yell, hurrah for Israel in attempt to cheer up those they were leaving behind and Brigham Young's leaving behind his wife.

Seven children and she had just given birth 10 days earlier and everyone in her house is sick. All of the children are ill. They all have malaria. Yes. They're so sick. And she just gave birth 10 days earlier. And so they're shouting, hurrah for [00:22:00] Israel as they leave on another mission. And so putting this like, I love this perspective because we've got two missions going on.

Brigham Young's mission, the sacrifice of both of them is mm-hmm. Un, I mean, I, I can't even imagine that level of sacrifice. This is such a great story for people to read so that when you read this background and then you go into section 26, and I love everything we've just read because now you read verse three with this air of like a sigh of relief.

Yeah. Like you said, Holly, when you, I'm sure when she heard Joseph say, take a special care of your family from this time heth force and forever like. Your work is, you've done great. Thank you for all of your efforts. I mean, she must have, she must have just sobbed. Mm-hmm. But what is, what is amazing to me is these two really believed, yeah.

They believed that the church of Jesus Christ had been restored on the earth, and they were willing to sacrifice their very lives to, to make that available for me. Oh, I love that. I mean, she built a log cabin for, for crying out loud. Right. And then she'll traverse across the country to get to Utah. Oh, gosh.

Die in Utah at age 73. I, I can't believe she didn't die at age 40. Right. Given all these things. But Yeah. But like, you know, you think about those pioneers and you know. They, they really believed it was their testimony of the Book of Mormon. Mm. Yeah. I have a question for you, Diane. Well, you, you said you were a convert.

What was your conversion? What, how did you learn about the church? My grandma in Puerto Rico, I was young, probably four or five. She became a [00:24:00] member of the church through missionary work. My dad was a Pentecostal and so we would go to church once a week. And then my mom was raised Catholic and so we, I would go to mass with my mom once in a while, and then my grandma became a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, and she would take us once in a while.

So I, I grew up going to multiple religions and being exposed to multiple religions. When my family moved to Florida when I was 12, I lost contact with the church or any churches, but I missed that. I had a void in my life. And so I would go to church with my friends in Florida because my mom would work two jobs as a single mom.

And so after school I would go with one of my best friends and they were either Baptist or like several different type of religion. And so anyway, my. Grandma and two of my aunts would often just send us like the Leo Hona or the friends once in a while. And when I was probably a sophomore, sophomore, junior in high school, we visited Utah for summer vacation for the first time and stayed here for a few weeks.

And that was very enlightening to me when I went to church with my aunts and uncle. It was just, I was very curious about the gospel. Mm-hmm. But I went back home and. Continued my life like normal, which was non-practicing of any religion, just visiting with friends. And, um, my senior year in high school, it was Christmas time and back then you needed the physical printout of your airline ticket to be able to fly.

'cause obviously we had that. So my mom [00:26:00] had, my sister moved to Utah, she's older, and my mom had purchased a ticket for her to come home for the holidays. So I was in charge of going to the post office and mailing her her plane ticket home. And in the line of the post office, it was a super long line, but in front of me there was a lady, and in front of the lady there was three elders.

And so we had been waiting for about an hour in line. And um, then the lady got frustrated and left. And now I'm right next to the elders. Right. And I was like, Hey, I know you guys, you guys are, you're Mormon. It's, you know, that's what, um. I knew back then and they're like, yeah, are you? And I'm like, no, but my grandma isn't an aunt and and whatnot.

So we just chatted and waited in line and had a good conversation. And afterwards they invited me to come to church and I said, well, I actually have no idea where the chapel is here in Florida, so where's the chapel? What's the address? And then so they gave it to me and I was like, okay, great. I'll see you then.

And I don't think that they expected me to show up, but once again, I'm accustomed to going to church. Mm-hmm. So I show up to church and they were pretty shocked that I was there, but. I took the lessons and three weeks later I became a member of the church. So January, 2000. Wow. I was baptized. I was 17 years old, my senior year in high school.

And for me, it was a time of life where I was seeking. Um, I really wanted to understand who I was and what was my path, like, what was my purpose. I was really conflicted, like, where do I go now that I'm graduating high school? What decisions do I make? Really learning the discussions helped me gain a conviction to mm-hmm.

The gospel of Jesus Christ and understanding who I was. And when I read the story of Maryanne and even Brigham Young, it talks about not just their belief, but true [00:28:00] conviction. Like they needed, they had the desire to preach it and to share it and to testify and to live it right. Sacrifice everything of their own to be able to spread the gospel.

I love Marianne's story. It resonates with, with me, with how clear of an understanding she had of what the gospel meant and the importance of the gospel. That's a great story, Diane. I'm so grateful you shared that. I'm glad you were in the post office next to missionaries. That's a great story. That's so cool.

I mean, God knows your address, right? Amen. He, he knows where we're gonna be. And He got my digits. Yeah, he got your digits. Got your digits. Well, thank you ladies. What a great discussion of 1 26. I mean, how many times have we overlooked those three little verses and yet the truth that came from it in the spirit we felt from stories that have been shared and feelings about their stories.

So thank you so much for doing that. And as a fun side note, Maryanne Angel, that is her last name, and she is the sister of Truman Angel, who is the architect of the Salt Lake Temple. So she comes from, from some stock that believed. I thought that was kind of neat. Now, the interesting thing though, is after this revelation was given, two months later, Joseph Smith goes into hiding.

So in the next segment, we're gonna tell you what he's doing in hiding and what he happened to write. Coming up next.

Segment 3

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This story is so good. Alright, so I did say Joseph Smith went into hiding two months after the revelation was given to Brigham Young. And here's the reason why. So back in May, this revelation was given in July. Back in May, there was an attempt on the life of Lilburn Boggs. He was the former governor of Missouri.

Now people were accusing Orrin Porter Rockwell of being the one or the perpetrator of the act. And I love that in the [00:30:00] storyline, people say, well, if Orrin had done it, you would've been dead. So they laugh that there's no way Orrin could have possibly tried 'cause And is this Porter Rockwell like, yes.

Porter Rockwell with long hair. Oh yeah. The Porter Rockwell. Okay. So it's that. So his first name is Orrin, but we all, yes. We always just call him Porter. Okay. Totally. So they're accusing him of being the perpetrator of the act and that Joseph was an accessory to the crime. So Joseph goes into hiding. Now, governor Thomas Reynolds of Missouri, he issued an extradition request to Governor Carlin of Illinois.

He's asking that the prophet be arrested and be brought back into Illinois. Now he is arrested and when Joseph gets arrested, he's temporarily released in August. 1842. So two months after the revelations given to Brigham Young. Now, because there were strong negative feelings towards Joseph Smith and the fear of him was being kidnapped and taken back to Missouri.

So he actually decided it's not wise for me to appear in public anymore. So he went into seclusion and he stayed in various places in Navu as well as I thought this was cool on an island in the Mississippi River, like he just became a man to himself on a little island. Well, he's Tom Sawyer. Totally. Tom Sawyer it in the Missouri River, and he also stayed at the home of James Taylor, who is the father of John Taylor, the third prophet of the church.

Now while he's in hiding in the Taylor's home, Joseph writes two letters, and those letters are sections 1 27 and 1 28. And he writes 'em to the members of the church. So if you go to section 1 27 and you see where it says an epistle from Joseph Smith, highlight epistle and just go ahead and write letter.

That's what it means. So sections 1 27, 1 28 says the same thing, an epistle. So I'm just imagining, here's prophet Joseph Smith in hiding, not wanting to be arrested. He's trying to spare his life, and I'm just thinking of all the things he could have done. He's like, I'm gonna write some letters. And he writes these two letters to the saints.

Two very important letters. And so we're gonna dive into now section 1 [00:32:00] 27, which is the first letter he wrote. And here's my question to my guests because I thought this was very fascinating. The question is, imagine that you just met someone who knew nothing about the prophet Joseph Smith, and all you could use is doctrine and covenant section 1 27 versus one through four.

Verses 11 and 12 to describe him. What do these verses teach us about Joseph? What do you guys got? I just feel like he is so confident in the Lord, and so I think I would, you know, I'd probably preface it with his experience, but of course I'm not allowed to. But anyway, I, I would, anyway, I'd break your rule and I love how he says, you know, I, I've been in all kinds of tribulations and, you know, face the wrath, all of men, all the days of my life.

And it would seem mysterious unless I was ordained from before the foundation of the world for some good, end or bad, as you may choose to call it, judgey for yourselves. He's just, he, he is not afraid. To tell people, like, go and find this out for yourself. Right. Like, I, I know what I saw in the Grove when I was 14, and I know of all the heavenly visitors and inspirations I've had.

And, um, you can know too. And, um, I, I love that Holly. Yeah. I love that Call judgey for yourselves. That's in verse two. Mm-hmm. That is good. And that God knows all these things. Yeah. So go interesting. Go ask him. He'll tell you. Ooh. Yeah. He definitely is helping us seek our own revelation, like Holly has said here, where we can get our own answers.

'cause he's, he pretty much on verse 11, like Holly [00:34:00] mentioned earlier in our conversation, he says, I now close my letter for the present, for the want of more time for the enemy is on the alert. And as the savior said, the prince of his world cometh, but he has nothing in me. Mm-hmm. So that's, that's very powerful.

He's being persecuted. He is hiding and he's sending a letter to the people, members of the church with so much power, so much strength, conviction, saying, I know what God knows. No one can take that from me. It's you, anyone can believe what they wanna believe. You should seek your own answer. And I think that's something very prevalent for us today, right?

Where we are constantly being questioned whether we are questions whether X, Y, Z, and, and relying our, having our testimonies rely on others. Mm-hmm. I think that this is a season for us to really ponder and gain our own personal revelations and conviction and know that if you have that no matter what, no one has anything on you.

Not Satan, not someone trying to distract you from what you, how you wanna live your life and how you wanna live the gospel. And I think that it's very prevalent today, just as it is then. Diane, I love how you said that because you're right. I've never considered the connection to that verse where everything was going against Joseph Smith.

There were so many enemies against him that it would be so easy to be like, Satan's getting a hand. I'll tell you what he is. He's doing great. But I love how he just calls it out and he's like, Satan's got nothing on me, don't you Saints even worry. You know, God's in charge. I think that is an awesome connection.

It just made [00:36:00] me think about how, I think we've seen an uptick in anti Joseph Smith's rhetoric and, and feelings, and it's very trendy right now to look at Joseph Smith's life would do 2025 glasses. Mm-hmm. And to look at Brigham Young and be like, oh, what, you know, what a this or what a that. Right. Um, but.

It's not really fair to do that. But at the end of the day, you know, he says, judge for yourself. Mm-hmm. And by their works shall we know them? And so Joseph Smith translated the Book of Mormon. If the Book of Mormon has blessed you, if there's truth there, then Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. And it's just so beautiful and so simple when we look at it that way.

But we can have all the questions in the world that we have. We can even have questions with our 2025 glasses. And that's not a threat to anybody. Ask away. But you go to the Book of Mormon and if you feel the spirit when you read something, if you feel truth, then Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. The end.

Hmm. Oh, I like that. And when you say it, I believe it. I believe it. I do believe it. I know you do. Yeah. You always have. I, you know, you have such a testimony of the Book of Mormon. I do. And I, and I, I just, I feel like Joseph Smith is an underdog, and I always wanna root for the underdog. I mean, he is this uneducated poor, who's brave enough to be this young boy and be like, um, so guys, I, um, was out in the, [00:38:00] um, in the forest and, uh, here's what ha you know, I mean, hello, like, walk 'em up in an asylum.

But I think that, but Holly, I, I love, I know what you're saying 'cause it's kind of wild, right? A 14-year-old Yes. Is what he saw, especially in those times. But I feel like that's exactly what it means to be. What he's saying here, like he had a true desire to know at age 14. Yeah. Right. Everybody is saying, this is the truth.

It just doesn't align with me, with my soul, my nervous system. It doesn't make sense to me mentally, emotionally, whatever it may be. For me, I'm a logical person. It has to make logic in order for it to seep into my soul. Right? So when, when he did that at age 14, it was wild. 'cause he was so young and it was the times were So he was being disruptive really?

Yeah. Like he was really going against the grain. Mm-hmm. Because he didn't not wanna follow, he didn't wanna be a follower and it did not sit well with him. And I think that that's so beautiful and something that we can emulate now even, you know, not just as, as a young child, but as. In our forties and in midlife crisis and whatever age you're in, it doesn't matter.

Right. Do you know for yourself, does this, is this second nature, is this relationship and communion that you have with God, second nature, where you really have that direct line? And I think he had that mm-hmm. Throughout the whole time. Right. And I think that's what you're saying. He had that, yeah. That no one can take it away from him no matter what happened.

Well, and I love the line in verse two with, with both what, what you were both saying, and Holly when you said this, that you know, we're, we're viewing them with our 2025 lenses. It's interesting that at the end of what you read in verse two, he then says, but [00:40:00] nevertheless, deep water is what I am want to swim in.

Even now, his legacy will continue to swim in deep water. And I always just think like, my goodness, if he was a fallen prophet, he should have died rich, right? Mm-hmm. I mean, all those followers, all he had to do was just say, Hey, why don't you just pay me a little bit on the side to help provide for my family since I'm doing all these missions?

Never took a dime. The house he lived in, you would've thought for sure when he moved to Navu, he would have one of the most perfect houses across the street from the temple. He and Emma are down in the swamps getting malaria. Um, he thought for sure someone would in a dump. Yeah. They thought they'll save me a piece of land at the Navu temple.

They didn't. He lived as poor as the poorest of them in Navu. And look at Mary Angel. Yes. Like, it's just crazy to me that he just swam in this, in water and, and then he sets up a plan asking people for money, right? You've got the lo of diving. They're building the Kirtland temple. When it never went to him, he took all the money people gave him, and then he gave it away to serve the fast offerings and the tithes and.

Billing a house to the Lord. So that I think that for me is like he is a prophet of God. Like, absolutely. And he does. He swam in deep water, then he continues to swim in deep water. And he says it all has become a second nature to me. And I feel like Paul to glory and tribulation. And here he is hiding because he's afraid of getting caught and put into jail.

So the irony is not lost on me. I think with this, with this letter. So, you know, when I visited Carthage for the first time, it was during COVID and know it was Sandy and Johna, our, our friends Tam. Mm-hmm. And there was nobody there because it was COVID. And, you know, we're we bebo into the parking lot and we came up this, you know, these row this, these, this row, these beautiful trees and their sculptures.

I can't remember what they were now. And then when you get to the end of the pathway, [00:42:00] their stand, Joseph in Hiram. Arm in arm. Mm-hmm. Their arms around each other and it took my breath away. Why? Because the spirit testified to me that it's all true. It's all true. And I can't believe I that literally Holly Butterfield had the gospel delivered to me by my uncle Billy.

I can't believe the tender mercies of the Lord and how that changed the whole course of my life. I was talking to my daughter Sidney, about this the other day, and she's getting ready to go on a mission and just like that, that chain from my uncle to Elder Butters and Elder Hill to, you know, it was just this like little girl with a Dorothy Hamill haircut in Maine.

Just like, you know, living with my parents and. Picking up Marlboro lights for my dad. No filter at the market. And then you bet you were. Yeah. And then I can't believe I get to be a part of this. Wow. Beautiful. Holly. Thank you. Wow. Thank you to both of you for sharing. This has been spirit filled.

Absolutely. What great things to think about with the prophet Joseph Smith. And he's writing this letter and he is writing it to the Saints. And not only does he write this information about him and what we've just discussed, but there's also a really interesting truth and principle and piece of doctrine that he's going to write about them, which blows my mind.

He's writing this letter and then all of a sudden he's like, I'm gonna insert this right here. Do so in the next segment, we'll find out what that is.

Segment 4

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So to start out this segment and to find out what the little boop, do you like how we do that? That's your, that's your sound, Holly. You always do a like boop. [00:44:00] Yes. Yeah. Just put to find out what the little boop is that he wrote about in this letter, which is a big boop. I have a piece of artwork to show you that connects us to it.

So when you guys see this art, will you describe it in the best clarity you can To our listeners, we will paint a word picture. Please do. Oh, I think I, I, okay. So they're in a body of water and there's a man who is baptizing a woman in a blue dress, and then there is a woman sitting upon a horse. And boy do I love this 'cause I, I love horses.

And the sun is shining on the water and it's golden. The surround of it. Yeah. Oh, and I have no idea who these people are, but as I always say, everything in church would be better if someone rode in on a horse. It's bit serene too. Oh, I like your descriptions, Diane. Golden, serene. Yeah, I like that. That stands out to you.

Boy, great description. This is a painting by Anthony Sweat, professor, an doctor for Anthony Sweat. A professor. You well, I love the Tony Sweat. Love that Tony Sweat. Love him so much. He painted this 'cause no one in history has ever painted this moment that actually happened, and so I wanna tell you a little bit of history leading up to the moment that this picture happened.

This is so cool. So what you wanna know is on August 15th, 1840. Now remember Joseph Smith is in hiding. It's 1841. So a year previous in August of 1840, shortly after the Saints moved to Navu, Illinois. Joseph is preaching a sermon at a funeral of a church member, and his name is Seymour Brunson. And as he's preaching this sermon at the funeral, he notices a woman in the audience who's attending the funeral, and he knows that she had just lost her [00:46:00] son before he could ever be baptized a member of the church.

So he's preaching and he says in this sermon that the Saints could now act for their friends who had departed this life by being baptized in their behalf. He then cites the ancient Apostle Paul's teachings. One Corinthians regarding baptism for the dead, and he encourages the saints to rejoice that the plan of salvation was calculated to save all who were willing to obey the requirements of the law of God.

So the saints received word of this practice with so much enthusiasm that they began to perform baptisms in nearby rivers and streams on behalf of relatives, friends, and prominent people. And so this picture is the very first recorded baptism for the dead in the history of our church. It is performed by the, so the picture of the man in there is Harvey Olmsted.

He's baptizing the woman, Jane Nyman, whose son had died before he could be baptized. So she's being baptized for her son and the person on the horse is Vienna Jakes, and she is the witness of this baptism for the dead. Is that so cool? Okay. I love that you're setting the tone of the history and the time and the why, then.

And how powerful that the mom is getting baptized on behalf of the Sun. Right. So, beautiful boy. And we get caught up so much in the sisters, you know, like, you know that it, you know, the shushing and the, it has to be this way and, and like, we get so caught up in the technical things. Mm-hmm. But I love that these people like, heard that sermon and they were like, get the horses, we're headed to the river.

Like, we're doing this thing. And, and I, I love that Anthony Sweat taught, he taught me, and, and he's on record for saying this 'cause he was on the episode when we talked about this four years ago, [00:48:00] they went to Joseph Smith and Joseph Smith found out that this had happened. It was the first one to happen.

And so Joseph asked, well, what was said? How did it happen? And they explained everything, how she was on the horse as the witness, and that Harvey baptized Jane and Joseph said, what wording did you use? And they gave the wording that he had used to baptize her. And he said, good enough. Like he didn't even try to fix it or anything.

He's like, that'll do, that'll work. So the Saints were so excited about the concept of doing baptisms for the dead that they, and we talked about this in last week's episode. That they began to build the Navu temple and they built the baptismal font in the Navu temple in the basement. And it was the first part of the Navu temple to be built, that they actually dedicated just the font and the basement of the Navu temple first so people could perform baptisms for the dead before the whole temple was dedicated.

Is that cool? So that is how important it was to the Saints. And now we have a year later here, we've got Joseph, he's hiding out and here's what he has to write to the saints about baptisms for the dead. So let's go to verses. We are in section 1 27 and we're gonna read verses five through eight. And can we each take a verse and just read one?

We'll go Diane, Holly, and then myself. And again, I give unto you a word in relation to the baptism for the dead. I love how it says for your dead. Mm. Like personal. So personal like it's your dead. Oh, I like that it's your dead. Remind me to tell you guys something in a little bit. Okay? Barely. Thus, say the Lord unto you concerning your dead.

That's so cool. When any of you are baptized for your dead, let there be a recorder shut out To Gail Lac. He used to be a recorder Tam, my dad did. And let him be eye witness of your baptisms. [00:50:00] Let him hear with his ears that he may testify of a truth, sayeth the Lord that in all your recordings, it may be recorded in heaven.

Whatsoever you bind on earth, may be bound in heaven whatsoever you loose on earth may be loose in heaven. So there we go. We need order. Some like, and it goes back to your story that you shared. Diane, we need a record. Something has got to be recorded because they were doing him so fast that Joseph's like, okay, I love that we wanna do this, but now we need a little bit of order.

So you've gotta write down everything because future Diane Acevedos need to know what happened to their family members. Don't we love the brilliance of this, that Joseph, the Lord's like, okay, Joseph, now here's the next step. You've told them they can do baptisms, now let's record it. And you think about like, um, uh, you know, I'm, I, I love the genealogy.

Mm-hmm. And you know, yesterday I was looking at baptismal records from Hungary because I'm helping my friend do her genealogy. She's not a member of the church, but um, she really wants to understand her family history and to keep a record of something. I mean, that's like, that is so commonplace in these times and so important that they would keep records where In churches mm-hmm.

In government buildings, right? Like this in Bibles, they'd write 'em in their bibles, in the family bibles, like these records were, um, venerated, right? Mm-hmm. To be able to, and they were protected and, you know, and so I think like, oh yeah, of course. Um, the prophet Joseph Smith, you know, like next logical step was let, let's make this official and legit it, like legitimizes it.

Yes, that's exactly what it does. In fact, next to verses five through [00:52:00] eight, put section 1 28 versus one through eight. Which is the next letter that Joseph writes, because as he's in the Taylor home and he's writing these letters in his second letter, I love how section 1 28 verse one starts, let's just read verse one.

Holly, can you read that for us? You bet. As I stated to you in my letter before I left my place, that I would write to you from time to time and give you information in relation to many subjects. I now resume the subject of the baptism for the dead as that subject seems to occupy my mind and press itself upon my feelings the strongest since I have been pursued by my enemies.

That's crazy that that's, tell me why's I, I never noticed that, that like Baptism for the Dead is weighing on his mind why he's running for his life. Right. 'cause if I'm running for my life, number one, do I have snacks? Number two, where's my next meal? Is there a bathroom? Like, is there a bathroom somewhere dead?

Holly, that's hilarious. Right? True. Do I have Chapstick? I'm not thinking about the doctrines of the co No. Is there somewhere nice I can sleep and it Do you have more than one blanket? Yeah, because I'm gonna need a heavy blanket for my legs. 'cause I get the Jimmy legs at night. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. My own comfort's first.

Yeah. I, I'm not, I'm not like, like ruminating and uh, on, you know, but I can, I can feel that like, not pressure, but that like excitement and that like res that weight of responsibility that he feels about that. Mm-hmm. And I mean, his very best, best brother Albin had died. Yeah. And I mean. It's so stupid to me that we think we're on this earth and we're not gonna carry these relationships on.[00:54:00]

Right. I guess I shouldn't say stupid, but like, are we, like Of course we are. There's, I mean, we love our dog so much. I mean, a dog has a spirit. You can, you can see that. Mm-hmm. Like you can feel that maybe not your cat, you had Tammy, but anyway, um, but when you first got married to Jim, what was his name? I know I married name not Jasmine.

I know, but I, I, Diane, it's so funny, I always laugh. I married into two kids and two cats. I'm not sure. Which was harder. Those cats were beasts anyway, like, you know, then to think that like, oh yeah, we just live this life and like Tutu Lou. I mean, that's crazy. I can't wait for us to have a lake house with each other and then we're gonna cackle and laugh and, and just.

Enjoy eternity together. I can't wait. Yeah. Um, I love what Holly has shared because it is true that that's our normal instincts are that would, uh, for me, that wouldn't be top of mind. Right. But perhaps top of mind for me is the wellbeing of my children and my family and, you know, how are they gonna do if I were to be, you know, in his situation, but obviously his concern and he's getting direction and being inspired at this time, like, this is what needs to happen now.

Mm-hmm. For, for the church. And, and I love that he shares it with such, um. Tenderness. I feel like this section is very tender about the importance of it and the unification of it. And it makes me think of, um, in my family there's a lot of storytelling of our, you know, past generations and [00:56:00] who they were and why they were the weight, the way that they were and who were they raised by and, and the circumstances of that.

And I think that really helps us understand and rest, like relate to, to our family members or, you know, extensions of friends. And I think that this, in particular, the recording of these instances and sacred ordinances that are happening at such a early stage right of, of the gospel and the church, um, is, is, um.

Really the history of the pioneers and, and the foundational people that built the gospel was such, uh, eagerness and, um, almost like, what's the word? Holy, uh, the cia. Um, yeah. Urgency. Not urgency, not the word, but like, um, but it's not a word I wanna use. It's like this fierce desire to go do it. Like exigence.

Yes. And that's what I get from this. Like, he testifies it with such imp, imp, impress. I felt it as very, it's very impressionable of the tenderness and importance of the recording and of what's actually being done. Mm-hmm. And then seeing the members go do it. Yeah. Riding out the horse out into the river.

Yeah. Well, and also like Diane, when you're talking about that, like, um, cia, right? He's in hiding. Far as he knows he could be killed tonight. Right? Yeah. And this is like, he's like, Hey, right before I get murdered, I just wanna like totally like, like dial you all in on how the earth will actually crumble if we don't have a welding link between [00:58:00] our ancestors and us.

Yeah. That's how important this is. And also so shows the mercy of Jesus, right? Mm-hmm. Everybody, no matter their circumstance in all throughout time, all have uh, uh, all have salvation. And he is gonna use someone in dire straits to deliver that message to us. Yeah. Like he's using someone who's so busy fending for his life about to get killed.

Yeah. To let us know about that. So yeah. That is awesome. Thank you to both of you for what you shared. So this is so fun because here's what we'll do in the next segment. Then we're gonna get into section 1 28 and we're gonna read a verse that again goes to this idea of he's in hiding. But let me just tell you one more thing and we'll find out what it is coming up next.

Segment 5

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So let's get into doctrine and covenant section 1 28. And Holly, you've been talking a lot about this, about this idea of a welding link. And in fact, I love how you said that it's structurally, it will structurally fail without this welding link. So here he is in hiding. He just said, you know, this has been weighing on my mind something about needing a recorder, baptism for the dead.

But then I love, in light of everything we've talked about, verse five, will you read for us verse five, please? You bet. Because the wording is so great. Well, you know, he had a way with words, didn't he? Young Joseph? You may think this order of things to be very particular. And I wonder if that is like how, like that word can also be like peculiar.

Like it's so, it's so specific. It's peculiar. Mm-hmm. But let me tell you that it is only to answer the will of God by conforming to the ordinance and [01:00:00] preparation that the Lord ordained and prepared before the foundation of the world for the salvation of the dead who should die without a knowledge of the gospel.

How beautifully written this is, that Jesus, he had it all covered, right? Mm-hmm. Merciful, tender, like no soul will go without the opportunity. Well, it makes me think of the prayer you offered at the beginning, Holly, when you said the idea, we're gonna discuss how to connect the human family. No soul will be lost.

Now I'll tell you this, Diane, you probably know this about Holly, but in my world, in my life, Holly is my Jane Niman. Like Holly is the one that's running in and saying, let's get this work done. We need to do work for the dead. Now listen, she's not gonna get her hair wet. She's actually not gonna get baptized.

But yeah, Holly is gonna do the work for those us willing to get our hair wet. Diane's slapping so hard 'cause she knows Holly. But yeah, Holly's my go-to genealogy friend. And Holly, I just want you to talk to me a little bit about this. Tell us right now, because why did you even get into genealogy? Like why do you do it?

My sweet mother, Carol, before we had even heard about this newfangled religion called Mormonism, my mom was a storyteller and. I remember from a very young age, and she's taught, she's told my kids all these stories too. But like my Aunt Blanc, she was my grandfather's aunt, so she'd be my like, great-great aunt.

She was afraid of thunderstorms. And so she would like hide under the table and she would call my grandfather and say, Bob, Bob, there's a storm. She was afraid of lightning. And my mom made these people so real to me. Hmm. And even stories of her own life about ice skating on Neely's Muck when she was a little girl and, and the horses and the like, all these like key players.

Um, I mean, she painted a picture of my [01:02:00] ancestors that. Really, really had a deep impression upon me. And so even from a young age, we used to go on temple trips from Bang Gour, Maine, hop in the bus at like two in the afternoon, drive all night with a couple of breaks, get to dc, walk into the d Washington DC temple in her jean jackets, get into our white dresses and, and close, do 15 baptisms, hop back out, head over to the Smithsonian.

Always saw the air in Space Museum. It's, it's kind of a snoozer for me. But anyway, get back on the bus, no hotel, and would go back and, uh, 12 more hours and, you know, so it would take like two and a half, three days. We thought this was the greatest treat in the world. Yeah. And it, it showed me that doing work for the dead is worth riding a bus.

I mean. It took longer than 12 hours. 'cause we had to go to Burger King and stuff. But like 14 hours, 15 hours do the thing, give a little tour, hop back on, and that these grownups would take time off from work. That's what I'm thinking. The, the converted grownups to be with teenagers on a bus for that long.

Pat and Craig Rand on, and Tammy, you've been to their camp? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. The beautiful on, uh, on Beach Hill Pond. Pat and Craig Rand from the Ellsworth main ward. They, they were my ward at the time though, in Bangor. But, and I thought like, they must just love this. And then I think as an adult, like, oh gosh, I'm taking three days off from work.

I'm not gonna sleep. And I got all these, you know, rowdy teenagers and, and we're going to the te like, what? Yeah. And so it was my mother. It was those temple trips. It. I just, my mind [01:04:00] works in such a way that the spirit can show me. Even when I would do indexing, I would look up the people's addresses and be like, oh, you know Frank Jordan, he lived in Manhattan.

Look at this old town home from 1872. Mm-hmm. And I give a little tip of the hat to Frank and then go on to the next same. I just, these people are real boy. Now it makes so much sense that you had us highlight the word your in section 1 27. They really are your dead. Yeah. It's personal for you in all the work you've done because you are the genealogy friend in our friend group.

You love it. Yeah, you do it. You do. So let's get into section 1 28 and let's just read verses 15 through 18. And they're lengthy. We'll each take a turn and then Diane, I want you to jump in with your thoughts. So here we go. And we'll start with Diane. Then we'll go Holly then me. And now my dearly beloved brethren and sisters, let me assure you that these are principles in relation to the dead and the living that cannot be lightly passed over as pertaining to our salvation for their salvation is necessary and essential to our salvation, as Paul says, concerning the fathers that they without us, cannot be made perfect.

Neither can we without our dead be made perfect. And now in relation to the baptism for the dead, I will give you another quotation of Paul First Corinthians chapter 15 verse 29. Else what shall they do, which are baptized for the dead? If the dead rise, not at all, why are they then baptized for the dead?

And again, in connection with this quotation, I will give you a quotation from one of the prophets who had his eye fixed upon the restoration of the priesthood, the glories to be revealed in the last days and in, in a special manner. This most glorious of all subjects belonging to the [01:06:00] everlasting gospel.

Namely, the baptism for the dead, for Malachi says last chapter verses five, fifth, and sixth. Behold, I will send you Elijah, the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children and the heart of the children to their fathers.

Lest I come and smite the earth with a curse. Now 18. And it's a lengthy one, but it's, it's worth reading. So here we go, Diane. I might have rendered a planar translation to this, but it is sufficiently plain to suit my purpose. As it stands, it is sufficient to know in this case that the earth will be smitten with a curse unless there is a welding link of some kind or other between the fathers and the children upon some subject or other.

And behold, what is that subject? It is the baptism for the dead. For we, without them cannot be made perfect. Neither can they without us be made perfect. Neither can they nor we be made perfect without those who have died in the gospel. Also, for it is necessary in the unhear, in of the dispensation of the fullness of times, which dispensation is now beginning to usher in.

That a whole and complete and perfect union and welding together of dispensations and keys and powers and glories should take place and be revealed from the days of Adam, even to the present time. And not only this, but those things, whichever have been revealed from the foundation of the world, but have been kept hid from the wise and prudent shall be revealed onto [01:08:00] Babes and sucklings.

In this, the dispensation of the fullness of times jam packed. It is, it is really full. I think that this really, for me, it takes it when he says all the way to Adam. So I really got into genealogy work with my, when my kids were. Teenagers as a convert. I feel like I went through pri primary with my kids.

Mm-hmm. Um, and I went through young women, or even like being a Eagle Scout, a Weiler, Danley, wow. Whatever it may be with my kids. And so I went through different seasons of learning faces of the gospel and genealogy work. And I have never, even though I've been able to go back five generations, I'm, I'm stuck.

I'm stuck there and I haven't been able to tie my family all the way back to Adam and Eve. Nonetheless. I love that there is that clarity that we will have knowledge that they had then, and that it ties us all together. Right. Yeah. It unifies us. Oh, it does. Well, and, and going back to verse 17. This was such, I had never noticed this before, but it's, it is a lot in this.

And I wanna know what you think of all the things that could be said about baptisms for the dead. Why do you think Joseph considers this the most glorious of all subjects belonging to the everlasting Gospel? I mean, that's huge. I mean, it's, it's because, it's because of the mercy of Jesus Christ extends to everyone, to our ancestors who were maid servants and, you know, digging ditches and you know, Tammy, your people in Yugoslavia, they use Aax, [01:10:00] right?

Yeah. And like I always picture my great-grandmother and her siblings working. At the Sardine factory in Lube, Maine in the winter and how their hands must have been just freezing, packing these sardines and these cans. Mm-hmm. You know, just to survive. Yeah. And I mean, look at me, la di da. Right? Like, I mean, I have the gospel of Jesus Christ.

The very least I could do would be to baptize these people who lived for me. Yeah. And. Right. Greater love. Half no man than this, than he laid down his life for his friends like they did. And I love in verse 17, how I will send you Elijah, the prophet. Well, I'll tell you, Elijah, the prophet showed up at my house, uh, yesterday I went for an appointment with this woman.

She was telling me she, she's not a member of the church. And she was like, I really would love to understand my family history. So I said, send me your parents and grandparents' names. And then for a couple of hours last night I was sending her, you know, pictures of her great grandmother and, and good old Chad GPT.

You can put in a document. It was their naturalization document. I asked, explain to me why this woman would have left this area of Hungary when she did. And then Chad GTI gave me all the political and historical factors that contributed to why people were immigrating to the United States. It was right before World War I.

Whoa. And how she would've gone through Ellis Island, like it built this whole, I mean, you gotta verify your sources, but it, it tracks a plausible storyline. It did it like, and it wasn't, and I, you know, I was like, give it to me in hypotheticals. Mm-hmm. And it [01:12:00] was so beautiful to send that to her. And she felt the spirit so strongly.

And I mean, 'cause Elijah, like, is he the one we're supposed to set a place for di for dinner? Yes. Well, guess what, ladies and gentlemen, Passover. Right. He came. Pull up a chair. 'cause he is here. Oh my gosh. Holly, read verse 19. Your story is, we'll conclude with this. Your story in verse 19. Go hand in hand.

Alright, giddy up. Here we go. Now what do we hear in the gospel, which we have received a voice of gladness. Stop. I want you to read it with the punctuation. Okay. As an exclamatory sentence. Okay, here we go. Now what do we hear in the gospel, which we have received? A voice of gladness, a voice of mercy from heaven and a voice of truth out of the earth.

Glad tidings for the dead. A voice of gladness for the living and the dead. Glad tidings of great joy. How beautiful upon the mountains are the feet of those that bring glad tidings of good and that say unto Zion, behold thy God, raininess as the dues of Carmel. So shall the knowledge of God descend upon them.

That is exciting. God bless us everyone. I love it. Yes. I looked up dues in Hebrew. Oh. Um, just for you Tam. And it is a symbol of the resurrection erection. Hmm. Oh, I like that. Right. Glad tidings of Right. Uh, you know, these glad tidings are that they will be resurrection, that they are saved. Yes. Okay. This is so cool.

Thank you. Thank you for both of what you shared. So in the next segment, we are going to talk one more thing about these glad tidings about baptisms for the dead. And I just love this, that it's [01:14:00] a voice of gladness. Glad tidings of great joy. So we'll do that next.

Segment 6

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Now section 1 28 is so fun because verse 22, this is the verse of all verses and we've read it so many times, but in light of what we've been talking about now, it hits a little differently. So let's look at verse 22. We're going to read it because it ties back to the song. Have I done any good in the world today?

Holly? Come on. Seriously. What are your thoughts and feelings about that? Hyn, I thought of you when I wrote that intro. I mean, I always joke around and say it's a pleasure beyond measure. You do, right? Um, do you want me to read 22 please? Okay. I am gonna switch it up a little. Sisters, shall we not go on in So greater a cause?

Go forward, not backward. Courage brothers and sisters, and on onto victory, let your hearts rejoice and be exceedingly glad. Let the earth break forth into singing. I think about that woman whose son had just died. Yeah. And she, you know, she, they get on the horse. I'm, I'm picturing they're double, you know, they're doubling up and then they, she hops off into the river, let the dead speak forth.

Anthems of eternal praise to the King Emmanuel who hath ordained before the world was that which would enable us to redeem them out of their prison. That the prisoners shall go free. Oh. And Emmanuel in Hebrew means God is with us. Mm-hmm. So the king, the God who is with us ha. Ordained before the world even was.

That we would be able to redeem them out of the prison for the prisoner shall go free. I just love this verse so much because then we go back to how we started. Have I done any good in the world today? In fact, if you have participated in any way, shape, or form [01:16:00] doing work for the dead, you have not only done good in the world, but you've done good in the most glorious of all subjects belonging to the everlasting gospel.

That's how much good you're doing. And so I wanna show you a connection to this goodness that you've done. We're gonna just look at verse 24 because I love this wording. You may read this verse and it might seem like, wait, what are we talking about here? But it's actually really cool. So Diane, will you read verse 24?

Behold, the great day of the Lord is at hand. And who can abide the day of his coming And who can stand when he appear for He is like the refiner's fire and like the fullness soap. And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver, and he shall be shall purify the sons of Levi and purge them as gold and silver that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness.

Let us therefore, as a church and a people, and as Saints offer onto the Lord an offering of righteousness and let us present in his holy temple when it is finished. A book containing the records of our dead, which shall be worthy of all acceptation. Okay, next to verse 24, put this cross-reference doctrine and covenant section 13.

So we get to the part in 24 that says he will purify the sons of Levi and purge them as gold and silver that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness. Now you want to go to section 13 because in order for this to even happen, section 13 had to come first, and section 13 is very short.

This is the section of the Onic priesthood being restored. Holly, will you please read just that one verse? You bet upon you my fel [01:18:00] servants in the name of Messiah. I confer the priesthood of Aaron, which holds the keys of the ministering of angels and of the gospel of repentance and of baptism by immersion for the remission of sins.

My mind's blown. And this shall never be taken again from the earth until the Sons of Levi do offer again an offering unto the Lord in righteousness. Now, why is your mind blown? Because look at that. The keys of the ministering of angels, that is our kindred dead and friends and people we knew in the preexistence, they are using their priesthood power to bless us and to watch over us.

Mm-hmm. And I, I think of that, you know, back in the other section we just read about how we can't be saved without them and they can't be saved without us. And it reminds me of. That time, Tammy, we were in the Las Vegas temple. Shout out to the Las Vegas temple workers. Nicest, friendliest, best temple in the church.

And we were doing ceilings. And Becky Farley was a witness and I was doing them for my family. I was kneeling at the altar and Becky Farley was giving me like wild eyes and like, look, actually I was the witness, she was at the altar and she was looking behind me, giving me wild eyes. And I was like, Hey, you, thanks for subbing in for me, right?

Yeah. Because my knee hurts. And after she got done, she said, did you see them? And I said, who? And she said, all of your family on your dad's side mm-hmm. Were standing behind the altar and they wanted you to know that they're here and watching over your son. [01:20:00] Wow. Yeah. And that's this verse right here, right?

Yeah. The keys of the ministering of angels. It's all connected to baptism. It is for the dead. So, okay. This is so awesome. Thank you for sharing that story because look in that verse verse one of section 13, I want you to mark a couple of things. It says that this shall never be taken again from the earth, meaning the pre the priesthood highlight until, because Anthony Sweat actually teaches that.

That word in another revelation is so that, so it says it will be never taken again from the Earth so that the sons of Levi may circle the word do and right may, may offer, again, an offering unto the Lord and righteousness, meaning a future time. Now go back to section 1 28. We're gonna connect it 'cause it's the same wording.

It says right here. He'll purify the sons of Levi, purge them, that they may offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness. Let us therefore, as a church and a people and as Latter Day Saints offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness and let us present in his holy temple. So it's not just the sons of Levi, but Anthony Sweat suggests it's the sons and daughters of Levi.

That the sons and daughters of Levi may offer unto the Lord an offering. And what is the offering we give? What is our offering when we go to the temple? It's the name. It's the time you've put in to find the ancestor. And if you're not doing genealogy, it's just the time you're giving to do work in the temple that is your offering.

And so we're living in fulfillness of this verse that as a church and a people and as Latter Day Saints offer unto the Lord an offering in righteousness, let us present in his holy temple. Isn't that great? Let us present, let us show up. And Tammy, something you said to me a few years ago, I [01:22:00] feel like somebody listening to the podcast today, probably lots of people need to hear this, that the Temple recommend questions are to meant to keep you in the temple.

Yeah. They're not an exam where if you like have one. Like aspect where it's not a hundred percent you're out. It's not like that. It's just meant for you to affirm that you're trying. And so like is that I guess the sons of Levi? That's what it's saying. Proverbially speaking. We are fulfilling that revelation that the sons and daughters of Levi were coming to the temple when we're giving our offering because this is kind of cool that the name Levi in Hebrew.

Oh my gosh, you're gonna love this so much. Okay, mark the name Levi right there. Levi in Hebrew means to be joined or attached. Really That makes sense. Is that so cool? In fact, when he gets his name in Genesis chapter 29, verse 34, the verse of scripture says, and she conceived again and bear a son and said, now this time, will my husband be joined unto me because I have born him three sons.

Therefore his name is called Levi. When all of the sons are named in the house of Israel in every time they're named, their name is the meaning of their name is said in the verse. So it's very cool to read the significance of how they're named, but isn't that neat to think that the name Levi means to join together?

So of course, the sons and daughters of Levi are going to do that work, and I love this right here. Let us present in his holy temple. So we've heard from hb. So Diane, I wanna know from you, how has presenting in the temple helped you in your personal life and in being a single mom to your sweet kids?

There was a season in my life, especially early on, going through the divorce, where I was working and doing my [01:24:00] MBA and newly separated that I personally needed, um, the temple. And I went for two years on a weekly basis. Wow. Just because I could not get through the week, um, without that uplifting feeling and sense of hope.

And as I, as I, as you read verse 24, um, there's an image that comes to mind and I am terrible at this, so I don't know the name of the artist, but it's one of my favorite paintings. It's, there's a, a woman and a bunch of angels above her. Mm. And every time I went to the temple, I just felt like I, I am, I was doing work, um, and not necessarily doing genealogy work to take names there, but I was going to do work for the names that were already prepared.

And I felt so, so much strength, um, believing the temple and strength that I needed to get through the week. And by the end of the week, I was so fatigued and so emotionally and mentally drained that I had to go there. And I remember my second child, oldest daughter. Saw me really fatigued, just drained as a whole.

And she said, mommy, do you need to get up and go to the temple? She was 11 years old. She was like, I'll call Lela my mom. They call her Lela to come stay with us. And my mom not being a member till the day she's not a member. Uh, she is an anchor of support for me so that I could go and be filled with the strength that I needed by attending the temple.

And this is a great reminder for me because that season of my life, um, I. I got regular blessings and attended a temple and it was almost verbatim like, help me, father, different priesthood holders [01:26:00] too, um, would, that were not in the same room. So I, it wasn't like they were listening from one another. It was like God telling me over and over like, I will be to your right.

I will be to your left. I will lift the burdens. The priesthood will be in your home. You'll have capacity if you just continue to keep the commandments and lean onto me. And as I did that, that power that I received, I got more than what I gave. Yeah. And I think that going back, assessing my life today, and obviously I'm not in distress in the way I was 10 years ago in that moment, do we take, am I taking out for granted?

Are we taking the temple for granted? Are we not going and feasting? For sure. And, and you know what? There's a season for everything, right? So, yeah. But. Being able to reflect and say, I need that. I want that feeling. I wanna be participant of that. I want to be able to carry that with me. And I believe that Angels surround us, right?

We know that. And the more we do that, the more of their own power we can benefit from. Oh damn. I love that. I do too. In fact, it drew me back into section 1 28 because as you were speaking immediately, I had that thought. I went back to verse 15 that talks about that they without us, cannot be made perfect.

But your story is an example of neither can we without our dead be made complete, and going to the temple completed you during that time of your life. Like of course you can take this to be the ultimate completion in the next life, but I want completion now. And sometimes we feel empty or we feel lacking, and going to the temple completes us.

So thank you for that testimony of what the temple can do for us. And look at Diane leading with, mm-hmm. Exercising her priesthood power. Yes. And leading her [01:28:00] family and in her home. All fueled by, by those connections like that. And also I would say like. Tam all the times we've gone to the temple back when we could do Temple Tuesday.

Yeah. Right. Like that forged our friendship. And so I, I know like we're all in different circumstances. Not all of us are married. Um, and boy, like, I mean that sisterhood of going with friends, Diane, we're gonna go to the temple. It like forges your friendship in steal. Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Well, and I just think we're all modern day Mary Angels.

We're all modern day Maryann Angels just plugging along because we believe we're lifers. Mm-hmm. Oh, I love that. Wow. Well, thank you ladies. We're done. That's the end of our discussion. Wow. Okay. So gather your thoughts. Take a minute. And tell me from our discussion today, what's an eternal truth that you learned or something that will stick with you, something you maybe marked in your scriptures or anything that touched you.

I remember when Wendy Watson, of course she was Wendy Watson Nelson actually, she may have already been married to the prophet, I can't remember. But she said, I have a feeling that when we talk about our kindred dead, they get really upset with us 'cause they're not dead at all. Oh wow. And that those like you're your TS Diane, they are very much a part of your life.

And a year from now we are gonna know who they are. I know it. And will have done their work. I [01:30:00] can't wait. Oh yeah, I believe it. I have no doubt anyone can do. It's Holly. No, I mean the spirit. We're gonna head to the headquarters downtown. We're gonna pull out all the stops. We might have to fly to Puerto Rico.

Tam, you can come with us. All right. You can try your, your line out on a, on a man. Again, she's making fun of me. 'cause I went to Puerto Rico when I was single and there was a man that I really liked and, uh, I, we were walking along on the beach and I thought it'd be so romantic to say, why don't you carry me on the beach?

And he said, okay, it'll be hard, but I will try.

Viva Puerto Rico. Viva Puerto Rico. Puerto. Love it. Oh, you cracked me up. Oh, that's good. But we're doing, we're doing it. We're gonna find those ts we're gonna find those. That's awesome. What about you Diane? You know, I feel like I am. I've always been in a learning curve with the gospel and catching up, playing catch up, um, with the history and with, so I, I really have loved you centering the times of the, these specific, uh, chapters and the verses.

Hmm. And for me, I guess the truth that comes to, to mind is that we need to feed our testimonies. Mm. How do we feed our testimonies, especially nowadays where things are so contentious or whatever it may be, or distracting. Right? Mm-hmm. And for, and it's just a, a good reminder of what do I need to build a better relationship with my savior or the scriptures or, because it all speaks to us as differently, right.

The Holy Ghost speaks to us differently [01:32:00] and something may resonate with us differently, but I still feel exactly how I felt at 17 years old. Wow. As I read this and as I share and learn from you guys who are experts in the scriptures and, and the history of, of, of the church is that even not knowing all that, you know, I know.

Mm-hmm. And no one can take it from me. Like I know that God lives and that Jesus is my sailor, and it could be simple, and that is mine. And, and this. What we're learning and the, the things, um, that are taught within the scriptures are, can be applied today as it was then, and it's in a different format and different times, but it still applies to us, right?

We will still have those challenges and we still have to have courage and we are still to seek our own revelation of the truth so that no one can steal it from us. So that's what I got from it. Like, wow, do, does, do I feel different today than when I did of learning of a gospel and really having my own testimony?

And I don't if anything has gotten stronger and Diane, like, I think of all the people that you quietly influence, that are searching, that are lost, that respect you and. You, you live the gospel. Mm-hmm. And you emulate it and you're this like, force for good. And, and Diane, I would say you, you don't know who Diane is.

Like Diane is a big deal. And I know she's like, I'm not a [01:34:00] big deal. She is. But like, you meet with people from all over the world and for many of them, you will be the only member of the church of Jesus Christ that they know. And Wow, that is so beautiful because you, you're like, okay, well judge for yourself.

But I know, Hey, I'm glad it's her, their meeting and not you or me. Yeah. No, I'm just kidding. Well, I'm Diane's our front man. I'm glad. Diane's our front man too. Oh my gosh. Well, you can feel it in her testimony. I wanted to say amen. When she finished sharing that testimony, that was such a powerful witness.

That's my takeaway from our discussion is your witness at the end, because I love how I, when I connect it to how you started us out at the beginning too. I don't even know if you realize you said this, but you said how important it is to teach and live the gospel within the walls of our home. And I know that that's what you do.

That wasn't just saying it to say like, I believe that it's what you've done with your children as you've been a single mom. Um, I feel that, and I felt that in your testimony, so thank you for sharing that. Thank you so much. I love you. Thank you for today. I love you too. This was a great discussion of these sections.

They just came alive, so thanks. We're done. Thank you. Love you. Oh, gosh, that was a great discussion. There are so many takeaways. There are so many gospel truths that we're taught. Okay, go join our group on Facebook or follow us on Instagram and just share what you've learned. This is so much fun. And then at the end of the week, on a Saturday, we're going to post a question that relates to this discussion.

So share your thoughts. You can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at ldsliving.com slash Sunday on Monday. And go there because it's where we're gonna have links to the references as well as the transcript of this whole discussion. So go check it out. The Sunday on Monday Study Group is a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original, brought to you by LDS Living.

It's written and hosted by me, Tammy Uzelac Hall. And today our incredible study group participants were Diane Acevedo and Holly Butterfield Rawlings. And [01:36:00] you can find more information about my friends at ldsliving.com slash Sunday on Monday. Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is edited and mixed by Cole Wissinger and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom.

Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week and please remember that you and your dead are God's favorite.