The following transcript is intended to aid in your study. However, while we try to go through the transcript, our transcripts are primarily computer-generated and often contain errors. Please forgive the transcripts’ imperfections.

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Segment 1

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Three years ago, elder Gary E. Stevenson gave all of us a challenge to consider and even change the way we celebrate Easter from his talk. We might ask ourselves today from what he said, how do we model the teaching and celebration of the resurrection of Jesus Christ, the Easter story with the same balance, fullness, and rich religious tradition of the birth of Jesus Christ, the Christmas story.

So you guys, how are you doing? Or what are you doing? I wanna know. I'm actually gonna ask that in this week's question. I wanna know what you're doing for Easter, because this week's Easter episode will hopefully give us some creative new ways to celebrate Easter, the greatest true story ever told.

Welcome to the Sunday on Monday Study Group, a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original, brought to you by LDS Living, where we take the come Follow me lesson for the week, and we really dig into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall. Now, if you're new to our study group, follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your come Follow Me study.

Just like my longtime listening friend, Amanda Todd from St. George, Utah. I loved meeting you. Now, another awesome thing, and it's my favorite thing about our study group is each week we're joined by one or two of my friends, so it's always a little bit different. And today I have one friend, and this friend is the only friend I could think who had to be on this episode for Easter because we're talking about something so cool.

You guys, I am thrilled to introduce you to Chelsea Hayden. Hello Chelsea. Hi Tammy. We're so glad you're here. Hi. I'm excited. Oh my goodness. So Chelsea and I met several years ago. She has been a guest a couple of times on these most important books in the scripture because Chelsea, you guys, she has a background in Hebrew.

How cool is that? It's so, so fun. Oh my gosh. And not only that, you guys, she also is kind of an aficionado on the Passover. If you've ever wanted to celebrate the Passover, you're gonna wanna go to her website and just get her Passover kit. Tell us a little bit about that. 'cause that's what we're talking about today is the Passover.

Yeah, so I, for a lot of years I hosted for Wards and Stakes. I hosted a Passover, it's more like a Jewish Passover. And then kind of in the middle I explain a little bit of, of symbolism how it can relate to, to the church and Christianity. And during 2020, everything was in lockdown. And I thought, you know, this is a great time for people to have, like they, they want something like this.

Yeah. They want something to do. But everyone's stuck at home. So I decided to make kind of a DIY kit, um, and now I have everything on my website, chelsea hayden.com, where you can go and download it and it tells you everything that you need, everything to do. It links you to some videos that have explanations of symbolism, and it has the full hagada, which is the, the booklet, the script that you go through.

It's everything is there, and it's just, it is such a unique and powerful way to celebrate God and our belief in him and his power, and especially the atoning sacrifice of the Savior. So like it is just spectacular. Okay. I love that you just said it's a powerful way to celebrate God and then the atoning sacrifice of Jesus Christ.

Wow. Well, we're gonna talk all about Passover today and just like she said, the symbolism why it's important and it is such a fun thing to do with family and friends for an Easter celebration. And we're even gonna talk about why it's connected to Easter. So if you wanna know more about my friend and you wanna go to her link so you can buy a Passover kit, it's very, very cool.

You're gonna wanna go to LDS living.com/sunday on Monday and we'll have all the information there. And you can see a cute picture of Chelsea and all that fun stuff. And it is gonna be such a fun discussion, you guys. It's one of my favorite things. I do love the Passover. I've done it a couple of times, 10 outta 10, highly recommend.

But let's first figure out why it matters and why we should celebrate it. So grab your scriptures, 'cause we're gonna be in 'em today, and something to mark your scriptures with and let's dig into Easter. Hey Chelsea. First things first, when you are preparing for this discussion. And you were reading these chapters in the Old Testament.

Tell me what the Holy Ghost taught you. I kept thinking actually about a scripture in First Corinthians where Paul tells us that Christ, our Passover was sacrificed for us. And sometimes we hear about Passover and it just, it just seems like it's, it's a feast. It's an event. It's, it's something people do.

But he is the Passover and the whole point of Passover, the original Passover in Exodus was you have these Egyptians who have enslaved the Israelites for hundreds of years, and this is the moment that they are. Being set free and, and gaining their freedom. They're, they're no longer going to be slaves.

And I love that Paul says Christ is our Passover. So they received freedom from bondage, but we received freedom from death and sin and pain. And we received freedom to grow and change and to become like God because Jesus was our Passover. And we're gonna talk about a lot of the symbolism that's there.

But I think something that, that hit me in a different way than it, than it has before is to pull it back to, yes, Jesus helped us to be able to live forever. Right? Like we get to be resurrected and, and can gain eternal life because of him. But backing it up even to a smaller level of thinking, where do I feel stuck?

Where do I feel like I need an escape? I need somebody to save me from something. I need to be rescued. I don't feel safe. I feel trapped. And I think all of us have those, whether they're big or small, we have those little moments that feel just impossible to get through. Mm-hmm. And the message of Passover is the same for that, that God desires to save us and he has the power to save us, and he will save us in his way, in his time.

Even from those maybe smaller things, I guess we could consider them of just feeling trapped. Mm-hmm. Okay. I just wanna know though, 'cause if we're just two friends and at the table having lunch talk in scripture, when is the time you felt stuck? When did this work for you? Can you share a personal time?

Oh, yeah. Um, not too long ago I was, I've, I'm recently remarried and. We're blending families. And it was also long distance. We were, we have this relationship halfway across the country from each other and trying to make all of this work. And all of our kids are teenagers and very busy and going through their own dramas.

And it just was too much for me. It felt, it felt so just impossible. That's, that's the only word that I can think of. I bet. And I bet remember thinking like I felt trapped. I felt like I couldn't do anything to help anyone. 'cause there were all these problems that were just too big for me. And these words came into my mind where, where I felt like God was saying to me, well, Chelsea, it is impossible but lucky for you.

I specialize in impossible. Oh, I love that. And it, it didn't change my circumstances, right. But it gave me the hope and the faith. The trust to be able to continue forward knowing that God was on my side and that he was working all things together for my good and for the good of, of my husband and all of our children.

Thank you for sharing that. I felt the spirit so strong when you said that I specialize in impossible, especially whatever the outcome. 'cause sometimes the outcome isn't what you expect and that's the impossible that you wanted him to change, but it's the impending impossible about what's around the corner and he does.

I believe that. Chelsea, thank you. Let's read that scripture one Corinthians. Will you give us the reference so we can cross reference it in Exodus chapter 12? That's where everybody should be. Go to Exodus chapter 12 and let's just put a cross reference. One Corinthians five seven. Perfect. One Corinthians chapter five, verse seven.

And let's just read that verse. We read it for us Chelsea. Purge out therefore the old leaven that ye may be a new lump as ya unleavened for even Christ. Our Passover is sacrificed for us. Fantastic. Thank you. And if you're wondering, well, what does that mean? Purge out the old leaven. Oh, don't worry. We'll talk about leaven today and we'll connect it back to that verse.

So thank you for sharing that. That was beautiful. So let's dig into Easter and specifically a celebration that happens this Wednesday on April 1st, everybody. So it's gonna be this week. So that's the cool thing. The timing of it is awesome. You can do this celebration throughout this entire week, but if you really wanna pull it together and do it on Wednesday, the timing of this big celebration, Passover and Easter happening are just so perfect for this year.

We'll do that next.

Segment 2

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Here's what you wanna do. In Exodus chapter 12, there's a couple of cross references that I'm going to give you. They are Matthew chapter 26, verse two. So you wanna write that somewhere at the top of your page. You also wanna write Mark chapter 14, verse 12. And then Luke chapter 22, verse 15. Now all three of these passages that I just gave to you mention one thing, and they all have one thing in common.

Let's just go to one of them, Chelsea. Let's go to Matthew chapter 26, verse two, so that we can all understand what's going on. You know that after two days is the Feast of the Passover and the Son of Man is betrayed to be crucified. Okay? So here's a mention of Passover New Testament time. So at this time, then the Savior sends his apostles and says, it's time for you to get this meal ready for me, known as the Last Supper.

So Chelsea, is the Last Supper the same thing as a Passover meal? It is generally considered, especially in in our faith tradition. Mm-hmm. To be that the, the Last Supper was a Passover. It was not only Christ's last supper that we, his last meal that we have record of, it's also the last ritual Passover meal before Jesus himself is going to be crucified as the ultimate lamb of God and will replace it.

It's, it's this meeting point of two ordinances. You have the ancient covenant. Yep. Um, uh, Howard w Hunter called it the ancient covenant of protection is merging with the savior's atonement and is now going to be remembered as the sacrament, which President Hunter calls the new covenant of safety. So it's this, this little moment where the two of those things are going to kind of blend together and Jesus is gonna say, this is what you have been doing and this is what it's gonna mean going forward, and this is what it'll look like.

Beautifully said. I think that is just astonishing forever for people to think that the Last Supper was a Passover dinner celebration, and I wonder how much the savior knew as they were going through all of the different parts of it and the symbolism of everything. Like I wonder if he was like, that means me.

That's gonna be me. Like, I just would love, that's a good q and a we're gonna have if we get to sit down with Jesus and the end and be like, right. Did you know? Yeah. Did you also love to, I would allow, you know, if all of the men who were there, were they making any of these connections, is he's saying like, this wine is now my blood.

Yeah. Were they like, wait, we've done this forever, but we are seeing this in such a different way. This. Mm-hmm. It's such a different meaning. I mean, it's the same meaning, but much more specific and, and related to Jesus in ways that they, I'm sure hadn't seen before. Oh, that's a great insight. Now I'm just thinking of them when they're burying him and thinking that there was no broken bone and that he was without blemish.

Right? Which is what the lamb had to be that they brought to the Passover dinner. I wonder if they're having these visions of like make you're right. Making all these cool connections. Okay. That's very cool. I like that. Well, let's go into Exodus chapter 12. We have the Passover right here, and isn't it fascinating that we have the last final plague that's about to take place and in Exodus chapter 11, if you wanna mark those verses four through nine is where the Moses is told, here's what's gonna happen.

But before it happens, he preps everybody. He says to Moses, now tell the children of Israel. Here's what I'm gonna need you to do, and we're gonna get into all the symbolism about the lamb and the bread and everything. But first, Chelsea, tell us, 'cause you kind of set this up for us. We had this old style Passover and then it merged with the savior.

Give me a little bit more information about that. What do you mean? Yeah, so. The Lord commanded the people, the Israelites in Exodus, to keep this feast as a memorial forever. So this, these pieces, these things that they're doing, most of them, they are going to do every year. Like they have been being done once a year unbroken for now thousands of years, which is really impressive.

Yes. And over time it changed a little bit. They added a little bit more to it. The, the rabbis and leaders were trying to get a little bit more structure. So no matter where you lived, no matter where you were, everyone was kind of on the same page. Um, there's. There's a rabbi from England. He has, he has passed away just a few years ago, but he said, in the ritual of Passover, we see one of the most profound instincts of the Jewish mind memory is the guardian of hope.

Those who forget the past, become prisoners of the present, and those who remember the past have faith in the future. So this is incredibly important to the Jewish people. They, they keep this feast year after year, after year, after year. So by the time we get to the second temple period, which is what we call Jesus' time period, the second temple in Jerusalem is standing.

It's expanded a little bit every year at this point because people. They are in the promised land, but they're, they're coming for three pilgrimage festivals to Jerusalem, to this, the temple. And this is one of those pilgrimage festivals. So each family brings their perfect lamb. They come to the temple, the priest collects the blood sprinkles, sprinkles that blood on the temple altar of the lamb, the lamb is skinned.

They would take it home and roast it on a pomegranate spit, and then really quick pomegranate, spit really fast. What does a pomegranate have to do with the Jewish nation fertility and life, which I think is really appropriate when we're talking about Passover, right? Yeah. It's so cool. Um. So according to ancient Jewish texts, by the time it was Jesus' time period, they had added specific prayers.

They had several cups of wine. They were asking questions and, and answering those questions, having a discussion about what they were doing. They were singing hymns and reciting psalms. They were recounting the deliverance story and they were even reclining because in Greco-Roman times, the free people would recline to the side.

And you read that in the New Testament as Jesus and his disciples are having the last Sr. They're reclining because, oh wow, that's cool. A symbol that they're free people. So all of these things are, that's neat. Expanded from the original one. It's not as structured as today, but it is a lot more structured and a lot more developed into a kind of a bigger ceremony by the time Jesus is alive.

Oh my goodness. That's fantastic. So now we've gone into this like how it's kind of just morphed and it's become this big event, really big event, and it's super important. I, I wrote in my scriptures, memory is the Guardian of Hope. And in Exodus chapter 12, verse 26 and 27, that's exactly what I've connected it to.

Like I wrote it next to those two verses. 'cause I love how it says, and it shall come to pass when your children shall say unto you, what me, me by this service meaning the Passover? Then you shall say it is the sacrifice of the Lord's Passover who passed over the houses of the children of Israel in Egypt when he s smoked the Egyptians and delivered our houses.

And the people bowed the head and worshiped. And I just go back to even like, I'm gonna put next to that verse, God specializes in impossible. That is like the theme of this whole episode. I'm so glad you said that, Chelsea, because talk about impossible, this story right here. And so maybe that is what for me, Passover is going to be, is a remembrance that God specializes in impossible.

That is so cool. And it would make sense too with the Savior then, because he was about to overcome impossible odds for all of us. Absolutely. Wow. Okay, so here's what's cool. We're gonna talk about what all of the cool symbols are and what things mean in the Passover. In fact, before we do, let's read this quote by, this is by Elder Ulysses Suarez, and here's what he has to say about this symbolism.

Chelsea, will you read this for us? Sure. By voluntarily taking upon himself the sins of all mankind being cruelly nailed to the cross and victoriously conquering death on the third day, Jesus gave a more sacred significance to the Passover ordinance. Had been bestowed upon Israel in ancient times in fulfillment of prophecy.

He offered his own body and precious blood as the great and last sacrifice validating the traditional symbols used in the celebration of the Lord's Passover. Thank you. So in the next segment we are gonna talk about those traditional symbols. We'll do that next.

Segment 3

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Chelsea. Oh my gosh, I'm loving this so much. I was not prepared to just be awestruck with, I specialize in the impossible. Like that's the whole theme of the Passover. It's so cool. I might have to put that in vinyl lettering in my house somewhere on Easter. Like that's the whole message. Okay. This is fun.

It's, I think that it's, it's a good reminder that like, I think of impossible and I think of things like God parting the seas. Yeah. But there are so many other things in life, like things that we face all the time. That feel impossible. And nothing is hard for him. Nothing is too hard for the Lord. Yeah, I I, and I'm looking at this going and you thought the plagues were crazy.

Wait till you see what I'm about to do in two more chapters. I'm gonna part like see, like that's something that like the Israelites are seeing all of these things that God is doing and they're, I think in a way they're thinking this is like this culmination. This is the end for us. Yeah, this is, we are gonna be free, but really this is, we'll be delivered.

This is the beginning. This is just the start. Right. Of God's miraculous work with them. That's also a great reminder that sometimes when God helps us get through the impossible, there's more impossible to come. Yes. Like and do you know what? My work's not done with you. Someone said to me not too long ago, they were talking about how they were remarried and they were saying it is so hard.

But I, I remind myself that these problems that I have now are the problems that a few years ago I was begging God to be able to have totally, that I would be remarried, have a new person, like, be able to keep my family together. And that is such a good reminder that some of the things I'm struggling with now are things I, I prayed for.

I wanted children, but children are hard. Mm-hmm. I wanted X, Y, Z and then it, it comes with challenges and God helps us get through each one at a time. Yeah. And we talked about this on a couple of episodes ago, but I love it 'cause the guest pointed out with Rebecca when she finally got pregnant, she'd been, you know, without, she couldn't have children for 20 years.

She finally gets pregnant and the line she says is, if it be so, why am I thus, like, I got what I wanted, but why is it so hard? Hard. Why? Yes. And then she immediately in the same verse it says, so she went to the Lord and prayed, which I love because she knows he can fix the impossible. He's gonna help her in this situation.

Oh, this is cool. Oh, that's good. I like that. Okay, so let's go into the symbolisms of everything in the Passover 'cause this is really fascinating. And let's start, we're in Exodus chapter 12. We have first out of the gate versus three through five. Talk to us about this Chel. What are we looking at? Alright, so you may wanna circle or underline the word lamb.

Okay. 'cause this, this is the central feature Yeah. Is the lamb. And this lamb is supposed to be a yearling in the prime of its life. No blemish or broken bones roasted with fire and the whole lamb is eaten. And there's a lot of, there's a lot of symbolism there. But before I do, I, I wanna share that sometimes.

When I am studying the scriptures or trying to teach someone about something, they'll say, I think you're reading into it. Okay. I think you're just reading into it. And we do kind of read into things sometimes, but when it comes to Jesus Christ and the scriptures, he wants us to read into it. He wants us to read him into everything.

Like Alma 34 says that the meaning of the whole law, every wit is to point us to Jesus Christ. Yeah. And in second Nephi, all things are to the typifying of Christ. So as we talk about these things, we are gonna read him into all of these things. So, oh, I like that you set it up like that. So the lamb in verse three is Christ.

And in verse five, I'm gonna read verse five, your lamb shall be without blemish a male of the first year. You shall take it out from the sheep out from the goats. What do you think of the first year connects to Christ with I I see that like. I mentioned before in the, in the prime of its life. Mm-hmm.

It's, it's young, it's energetic, it's healthy. Yes. And like Christ was, he was, I agree. Not young. He was in his early thirties and powerful. Yep. And making change in his prime. That's awesome. So you have this lamb. So that's what the first thing they have to do, is they take the lamb, then they're told to kill it.

That's in verse six. And then verse seven, teach us what they're supposed to do with the blood. And I'll read this, I'll read the verse, and you can teach us Excellent. And they shall take the blood and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper doorpost of the houses wherein they shall eat it. So with the doorposts and the blood.

So they're using hisp to mark around the doorposts, which interesting. Interestingly enough, Jesus is fed the vinegar on the cross with hisp, with the his. It's a branch. It's used for healing and that's what they're using to, to paint around the edges of the doorposts. Let's read into that. That's pretty cool.

Love it. Right? Yes. So this is the only piece of the actions that they're commanded to do in the original Passover that doesn't continue on. Oh, from, I've never seen anything that that says people painted their doorposts after this. But the word Passover is a word that Tindale chose as he was translating this, and he chose to keep the word play that's there in Hebrew.

The word PAs or pasi is to passover, to hop, to skip over. It also means to protect, which I think is a great word, if that's awesome. If you think of they're covering it. And the word kfar means cover. Cover. The doorposts kfar. To cover is also the word used in Kippur, if you know that that is the day of atonement.

Mm-hmm. To cover means atonement. So we are using the atonement to cover ourselves so that the angel of death will pass over. That's, that's pretty powerful. And something, something that is so powerful to me about the blood is that this is the symbol that says the angel will pass over. It's not eating the lamb, it's not eating the bitter herbs.

It is the blood on the doorpost. Mm-hmm. And blood, according to Leviticus, we think of blood, we think of, oh, you're, if someone's bleeding, they are dying. But for the Israelites in Leviticus, chapter 17. Moses says, for the life of the flesh is in the blood, blood is life. So they are putting life, the life of the savior all around their doors.

And that's what's protecting them from the destroying angel. Oh, that's neat. I'm writing that down. And again, it's just striking me that they're getting all of this information before the last plague. Like just all preparatory. 'cause when that plague comes, get ready. But there's something they had to do.

This strikes me, verse 15. So he talks about the Passover and what it is a token of. We've read verse 13, and then it talks about in verse 15, seven days shall you eat unleavened bread even the first day. You shall put away lemon out of your houses for whosoever eateth lemon bread from the first day until the seventh.

That soul shall be cut off from Israel. Talk to us about this leave bread. I, I love the tradition of getting rid of lemon that they still do to this day. This is still practiced. Right in, in Hebrew, it's ts that is your yeast, your leavening agent. And I imagine, like, think of the most white, fluffy, soft bread that you can think of that is because of leave.

So you take all of that out and you end up with something that's dry, sometimes crunchy. There's not a lot of flavor, but it doesn't spoil as fast. Right. So I think there's, there's so much in there of like, all we need is God, he's the essential, the, the, the one thing that we need to rely on. It was considered the poor man's bread because it didn't require, it just had basics in it.

You have your water, your flour, maybe a little oil. Mm-hmm. That's all it takes to make it. And even today they have like, it's even expanded to, they go into their house, they clean out anything that has lemon in it. Everything has to leave the house. Not just taking yeast out, but anything with leaven and they wipe down counters and cabinets.

Mm-hmm. It is like the ultimate spring cleaning. Right. Oh, it's, I love watching it on you too. Metimes. They'll be a feather. They'll go through and pretend like they're, you know, they make a big thing of it. Oh, it's, it's a big deal. Even their pockets, coat pockets. Yes. Anything that might have like a goldfish cracker.

I don't know. Their cars, they clean up their cars. Right. It's crazy. Your couches, you clean all of those, like think of where you find crumbs. I mean really they are everywhere. It sounds terrible and it sounds almost a little overwhelming to me. Like sometimes I think of that when, when we're commanded to be perfect, there's this feeling of almost dread of, I can't do this again, going back to impossible.

But he's not asking us to do this all at once. It's. It's a process and he wants us to do the best that we can. Mm-hmm. And over time, by the time it's eternity, all of the leaven will be purged from our souls and our families. Right. Well, let's connect this. Let's connect it to the scripture you shared with us in First Corinthians then and we started.

'cause this is where it all connects for me, because we're not required to go through our houses the week of Easter and clean out all the bread, but leaven, let's read into what leaven is. 'cause I thought this was so cool. So I'll read this verse again, and then I want you to talk to us about what is our 11 today.

So in First Corinthians chapter five verse seven, it says, purge out therefore, the old leaven that you may be a new lump as ye are unleavened for even Christ. Our Passover is sacrificed for us. Therefore, let us keep the feast not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

What leaven are we supposed to get rid of? How do you interpret that? I would say anything that is. Causing my soul to spoil something that's leading me away from life. Yep. Um, the things that are not leading me to true happiness that are distractions. They may not even be like quote unquote damaging, but if it's taking away from those things that are essential, I think that that's what I would consider the lemon.

Mm-hmm. That God wants us to be focused first and foremost on him, and then everything else is kind of extra. Yeah. I like the way you put that. Anything that's causing my soul to spoil. 'cause there are so many things. If you just chose one thing to give up that week of Easter, how fun would that be in your fam?

And everybody can have a different thing. Yeah. I know For me it's probably gonna be like some social media or something. I'm gonna challenge my kids to do that. That's a great idea. If it's something for social media, just for the full week of Easter. That's a great example of lemon. Something that you really like.

Yes. It's white and fluffy bread. Absolutely. So that reminds me of, as we're talking about cleaning out the, they could the, the Jewish people historically, and today they could just say, we're just not going to eat it. Right. We leave it in the house, but we're not gonna eat it. Oh, totally. And as you were just talking, it reminded me of elder ly Robbins once talked about the difference between if you are, if you are in a house and your doctor has put you on a diet that you can't have sugar, and you go into this house and they're making chocolate chip cookies and you know, you can just smell that it, it is sweet.

It smells comforting. It's delicious. Are you gonna go sit in the kitchen with your face right above those chocolate chips? If that's what you're not supposed to have. So he uses that to talk about the difference between resisting temptation, where you're putting yourself right in front of it and forcing yourself to not do it.

Yeah. Versus avoiding temptation, which is staying away from the places that you're gonna be tempted. And I, I've never really made that connection with Passover before, like cleaning out our houses. Yeah. But that is helping us avoid temptation when we're clearing out things instead of just, well, I'll leave it here in my life, but I'm not gonna look at it.

I'm not gonna do it. I won't fall into that. But then we're just fighting temptation constantly instead of letting mind be free. That's great. Wow. What a great example. I think you're right. That's true. They could just say, no, we're not gonna eat lemon this week. They really go all out and get rid of it.

What a great example. Uh, let's end this segment with this quote from Elder Holland because we have more symbolism to get into, which is gonna be so fun. But, um, let's read this then we'll each read a paragraph from you. And this is in the April, 2021 general conference regarding Easter. Tomorrow is Easter, a time for the righteous principles of the gospel of Jesus Christ and his atonement to Passover, Passover conflict and contention, Passover despair and transgression, and ultimately Passover death.

It is a time to pledge total loyalty in word and deed to the lamb of God who bore our griefs and carried our sorrows in his determination to finish the work of salvation in our behalf. In spite of betrayal and pain, mistreatment and cruelty, and bearing all the accumulated sins and sorrows of the human family.

The son of the living God looked down the long path of mortality, saw us this weekend and said, peace. I leave with you. My peace I give unto you. Not as the world giveth give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither. Let it be afraid. Have a blessed, joyful, peaceful Easter. It's untold possibilities have already been paid for by the Prince of Peace, whom I love with all my heart, whose church this is, and of whom I bear unequivocal witness, even the Lord Jesus Christ.

Amen. That just summed up everything that we've talked about today and I and specifically in this segment, when again, he is, he specializes in impossible moments. And so all the symbols you can just see, and I love how you challenge us. I think we should read into the symbolism 'cause I'm sure there's more.

And I, as people read, as you read Exodus chapter 12, find all the symbolism and connection you can to Jesus Christ. So in the next segment we're gonna do more of that. We're actually gonna discuss a very specific plate that is used during the Passover and all the meanings of the food on that plate. And you might wanna do this with your family.

It's gonna be kind of fun. We'll show you what that is next.

Segment 4

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Okay. We have a little bit of a show and tell Chelsea and I do, I asked Chelsea to bring her Seder plate and I have fine, we're gonna take a picture and put it on our show notes. Okay. Chelsea, tell us what does that even mean and what, what is a Seder plate? What does Seder mean in Hebrew? Alright, so Seder means order in Hebrew and after the second temple in Jerusalem was destroyed, uh.

After Jesus died, we have, you know, a hundred years and then the temple's destroyed, which means there is no longer the ability to sacrifice animals. So at this point, Passover shifts a lot and the, the rabbis are trying to figure out how they can have something that's consistent, especially because we have another diaspora, which means there are people now going all over the world and they need something that's consistent.

So by about the 11th or 12th century, we have this order of 15 different steps, and a lot of them were things that had been part of the second Temple version. Um, and so now we have these 15 steps. It is still basically the same today. And, and families and communities, faith traditions can have their own kind of, they can expand on it, they can add stories, they can add things that they would like to.

Within that framework. So it can be very personalized depending on who the family is, as long as you have those 15 different steps. And the Seder plate is the thing that holds the food items. Mm-hmm. That people are going to be partaking of as symbolic emblems during the over feast. Okay. So there are, there are specific food items that you're gonna put on this plate.

Now, if you don't have a Passover plate, you can borrow one. I've done that before. I've bought my own. I've also bought paper ones. That's the one I have in my picture. I have a real one. And then a paper one. You can just go on Amazon and type in Seder plate, S-E-D-E-R. And I've done these for wards. And Wards will buy a whole pack.

And then they sent me home with leftovers. And these are fun and it has pictures on the plate of what you're supposed to eat. So Chelsea, talk us through what the symbolism is of each one of these items that you eat at the Passover dinner. And this is not the dinner portion, so just FYI. This is for the ceremony of the Passover.

And then when the Passover's done, you're going to eat a big fancy dinner. Right? Right. So it's about two thirds of the way through. Oh, okay. You do a Passover, then you eat the meal and then you do more Passover. Perfect. So. In very basic terms, the story that you're telling of the Israelites explains the food and the food allows us to relive the story.

Okay? So each thing is very poignant. You have first the zaa, which is means arm. It's a roasted shank bone of a lamb. Mm-hmm. They do not eat lamb in any way, shape, or form for Passover because it would be sacrilegious, I guess is the right word, to do something where they can't sacrifice, they don't point to it, they don't even touch it.

It is just sitting there as reminder of temple sacrifices. There is an egg, a beza, and that reminds them of the free will, voluntary offering that's extra. That's mentioned in Deuteronomy, the marro or bitter herbs. This was part of the original Passover. Um, probably in Jesus' day it was some kind of bitter lettuce.

Now one of the more common things is to use horse radish. Very bitter. It is. It is very bitter. In fact, I, I've heard of a community that uses Sugarless chocolate, just cocoa bar. Oh, wow. I did that with my family last year and they said we would rather have the hottest horseradish. This is so bitter.

That's an interesting take. Right. Okay. Chocolate. So the bitter herbs represents the suffering of the Israelites when they were in bondage the pain that they had. It represents the pain of, I mean, think of the Jewish people. We talk about the Holocaust of the mid 19 hundreds, but they have had so many of those, like it is one thing after another, after another, yeah.

That, that their people have been put through. We could expand that to be the pain that the faithful people of all ages have gone through. And then if we put that into our Jesus lens, that would be the suffering that the savior. Went through for us where in Mosiah chapter three, verse seven, it says He suffered more than any of us could suffer unless we were to die.

And then in doctrine of Covenants 19, where he said the suffering that caused him even God to tremble and suffer and wish that he didn't have to do this. Yeah. If there's any other way, like this is intense pain. So ultimately the bitter herbs is helping us have empathy for our spiritual ancestors, for the savior, and also to help us experience in a very physical way what sin tastes like.

Like if our soul had that kind of, like, if we had that kind of reaction every time we sinned and we had to put something absolutely bitter in our mouths, I think I would be a little bit less likely to sin. Right? Gross. Yeah. 'cause it's disgusting. I don't even want horseradish on anything. Right. Gross. I knew, I know.

To avoid it. Isn't that interesting that we just connected that and it, it's. It reminds me that that like, that's what's happening to my spirit when I'm sinning and not repenting and not caring about it. It's affecting my spirit. So then we have the roit that is an apple mixture. It has some walnuts in it.

Usually it has grape juice and some spices mixed into it. And it represents the mortar that the Israelites used to. It's the best tasting thing on the plate. It is fantastic. And in many seders, they eat that with bitter herbs. So you eat the bitter herbs. Mm-hmm. And then you eat that with the bitter herbs and you don't want to eat the bitter herbs the second time.

No. 'cause you already did it once and you knew it was bad, but it's mixed with something sweet. And it can remind us of the sweetness of freedom. Mm. There's carpas, which are greens, celery, parsley are the two most popular. You dip 'em in salt water, it represents new life. And springtime, the tears of the Israelites.

And then last are four cups of wine, which I think is a very powerful visual. And I understand that we don't use why we don't use wine in our sacrament services, but the visual is just so amazing. It looks like blood. Mm-hmm. It reminds us of the blood of the lamb in a very, a very powerful way, I think.

Yeah. Wow. And then on some plates in the middle is the pa, the unleavened bread. Yes. And so tell us about the importance of the unleavened bread in this meal. So the unleavened bread is used multiple times, and it represents their haste in having to leave their obedience in following God, the cleanliness of their lives.

And. It's used almost as the spoon for some of the things, like it's the foundation of all of the pieces. Oh, I like that you just said that. It, it, the, it's a foundation for all the pieces because one of the things you can do is eat, you have the piece of bread with the horse Rad with the RoCE. It's like a little sweet bitter sandwich.

Yes. It's, that's called a Hillel sandwich. Yes. Perfect. Okay. So with all of this then, and we have this, this Seder plate and all of these really cool things that will remind you of what the Israelites went through. I love that you connected it to what the Savior went through and what the savior will help us get through and go through by eating and partaking of these foods.

There's a neat little tradition that they do at this meal that has to do with the unleavened bread and they cover it in a napkin and then it sits on the laps under the tables of the children and they pass it around throughout the course of the meal. And at the very end of the meal, whoever has it gets a prize.

I love doing that 'cause it's hidden and you don't know where it is. And that's what the actual unleavened bread or matza in Hebrew means is hidden. And so they hide it throughout the dinner and then they can find it. And so this specific dinner or ceremony that we've been talking about, Chelsea's gonna go through it with us and we get to talk about a word that I love that is in this whole ceremony and what it means and why it's so significant to me.

And so we'll do that next.

Segment 5

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So Chelsea, this is your thing. This is what you like. You have done so much time and preparation in paying the price to teach this and practice this with people. Talk to us about the Passover, the Hara, or the Seder service. Fantastic. This, so my love for this, by the way, started when I was in seminary and we just had a very basic, during Exodus, we tasted some of the foods and I remember the horse radish and how powerfully it taught me about the atonement.

And I remember thinking, I will never forget this. And I haven't. I still haven't. Yeah, I think we used horsey sauce from Arby's and I still cannot eat horsey sauce because of that experience 30 years ago that I had. And there is something incredible. About the Passover service. It is. You use all of your senses.

Mm-hmm. It is good for all ages, every learning type. There is something for everyone. It usually lasts at least two to three hours. Some families do it six. Some families do it for nights on end, but it always includes the same 15 steps that we talked about. And the theme that runs through it is the story of the Exodus, and it starts with Abraham, the Abrahamic Covenant through their time with the Egyptians, through being freed through their time as they're crossing the Red Sea.

It kind of has this, mm-hmm. This whole storyline and then you take the different parts of the food. So it's really a powerful way to remember things. It's. One Rabbi said that by enacting it, like they don't just sit and read it passively. They participate. They are expected to imagine that it is as if they were there.

The wording in the hagada, the script is, uses we and I, it does not use they because we need to imagine that this is us. We are experiencing what they experienced. And so if you add these things that you're tasting, you're smelling, you're hearing, you're singing, you're dancing and clapping. For some of it, it is such an incredible way to use doing, to bring feeling and power.

Mm-hmm. That lasts a lot longer than if you just were to sit and hear something. So they Oh, for sure. They have this whole thing laid out and it includes questions and discussions and one of my favorite things, honestly about it, one of the things that has just endeared me to the Jewish people is. The theme of using blessings for everything.

They have specific blessings to pray for each, each of the steps that you're, that you do, in almost all of them, there's a prayer associated with it. And what it does is it makes that thing holy. It consecrates it for that purpose. Because remember, they don't have a temple anymore. And so for these times that there's Shabbat, when you're having Passover, the home is imbued with a little piece of the temple.

You get that connection to God. And so they're consecrating it. They're saying prayers asking for God's permission to use these things, being grateful. But the thing that is most impressive to me is that they are not just grateful, they embody adoration. Mm. Yeah. As Latter Day Saints, we are, we, I think we do a good job of, of teaching gratitude.

And the, the difference that I see between gratitude and adoration is with gratitude. You are so thankful for the gift. I am so thankful for the savior that he did things that I will, I will never be able to do for myself. But adoration means that you're thankful and honoring of the giver of the gift. Oh, yeah.

So even when you don't get what you want, you are still incredibly grateful to that giver of the gift. And so you see that theme all the way through. And just one more thing about blessings at the end after they eat is when they say their blessing on the meal, it's called Grace after the meal. And someone asks their rabbi, like, what, why?

Why do we do this after? And he said, this. To thank God when we're hungry is natural. To thank him when we're sated is more difficult. It is precisely when we are most likely to forget that we need reminding that what we have, we have from God, the creator and sustainer of all. Wow, isn't that great? Like, oh, I think that's awesome.

Yes. It's easy to say. I'm so thankful for this food when it's, yeah. Fast Sunday and I'm so, I'm starving. I haven't eaten. It's another thing to remember God after I'm done eating. Wow. Thank you, God, for being so great. It's really the way that they honor God is just so incredibly impressive to me and inspiring.

Well, it makes me think then, when you talk about how, why they pray at the very end is that there's a word that they say at the very end, this is the word that I love in this whole entire experience, is the word, um, nu and they say it several times at the very end, but they, and so nu means it would've been enough.

Is that correct? Yes, it would've been enough. The thing that I love about that word is because they say it would've been enough when it comes to all of the hard things they went through. They say if we had stayed and been slaves, it would've been enough. If we hadn't even been protected, it still would've been enough.

Like that's the adoration part. Yes. They're still giving credit to him because they're, they're saying almost against all the good things that they had received. In fact, the company recites this nu They sing it. They sing it. Thank you. Yes. And so it's just basically saying It would've been enough or it would've satisfied us.

So then they say it almost sort of like a reflection back. If we hadn't even had our prayers answered, it still would've been enough. It's just this beautiful thing you've taught us about adoration. They say had he brought us out of Egypt and not divided the sea for us. D knew it would've been enough.

Like I love that they just, okay. If he had divided the sea and not permitted us to cross the land, di knew if they, if he had permitted us to cross the sea on dryland, but not sustained us for 40 years in the Deseret, di knew, di knew and they sing. How do they sing it? Can you sing it? I'm gonna read the line.

I want you to sing it the way they would've. Do you want me to do verse one for you? I'll do verse one, please. Yes. Okay. So it starts with, let us out of Egypt, split the sea for us and fed us with the manna. Okay. This is like, um, this is like our rest him on steroids. This is great for kids. You can get up, you clap, you start slow.

Okay. This is, do it please. You would think that this would be like a very reverent, we're thankful, like how great they work, but it's not, this is very, we're getting our blood pumping. So you clap, you start slow and quiet and then you get to the chorus and it's like, this is, we are so grateful for this.

Okay. I'm so excited. Had he let us out of Egypt, only let us out of Egypt, never split the sea forest us so die. Had he split the sea forest us and only split the sea, forest us, and never fed us with the man, die, die, die, die, die.

So they have several verses of that fun. Perfect. Thank you for not being embarrassed or shy to do that. That's what I love about you. Chelsea's not, she's a performer. Oh. I have chills because just taking that and applying it to your own life, like, you know what, if all I had done is is gotten married and never had children, it would've been enough.

But then I did have children, I had to blend family, and that was hard. But you know what, that would've been enough. Like, yes, you can just apply that to so many aspects of your life and, and seeing these people who had been through so much and they have such adoration for their God, they're like, that would've been enough.

Oh, you know what I think is kind of funny, that the, the rabbis who put this in, yeah, they could see that we don't, we, the children of Israel, we're not like this. We don't get records of them singing. Diane. We get records of them complaining and they said, we want to do a better job. Love it. We are going to do this as if they were thankful for these things and, and I think how often.

How often am I like, okay, God, what have you done for me recently? Mm-hmm. Instead of, you did that, you did that, you did that. You did. Like if, do you remember when Henry b Irene gave his talk in general conference called, oh, remember, remember he said for years he wrote down how he saw the hand of the Lord in his life that day.

Okay. And he said it was amazing that sometimes he wouldn't know what to say, but just by trying to remember the spirit would touch his mind with something that God had done for him. Wow. And that has been really meaningful for me. I, for a while I was really good at it and I kind of go through phases where I'm good.

But when I am, when I am looking for God's hand in my life, I see so much more. I am not thinking, what have you done for me? I am thinking, oh my goodness, you are so good. Mm-hmm. To bless me with so many things, and it's often not the things I wanted. He's there and he's with me through every single step.

And it's, it's really powerful to look for God's hand instead of wondering, what else can you give me? Nu nu. Oh my goodness. That was awesome, Chelsea. Thank you. Thank you. And the thing I love is now I'm gonna be singing that song. And the cool thing is, is I feel like when you're driving around and you're thinking of everything going on in your life, even the hard times, I hope that word pops up in my head.

Nu, it still would've been enough. Oh my goodness. Yes. Okay. So that's the ceremony, that's the Passover ceremony. But there's one really important part of this that happens at the very end, and it has to do with a seat at the table that has remained empty the entire dinner. And Chelsea's gonna talk to us about that in the next segment.

Segment 6

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So you've got this beautiful table. It's totally set up. Everybody's seated, but there's one spot at the table that no one's sitting at, but there's a table setting, there's a plate, there's silverware, there's cup, there's wine, everything. Tell us who is this for and what's going on. Alright, so this is for someone who's actually pretty controversial in Jewish history.

He is someone that was powerful, he was kind of enigmatic, he was dramatic, he was intense. He worked miracles. He was very mysterious and very complex. And that is the prophet Elijah. Mm-hmm. So he's also referenced in, in Jewish culture. In Shabbat prayers, in and in circumcisions. But in Passover he holds a very special role.

So in Malachi chapter three, Malachi prophesies that before the great and dreadful day of the Lord, Elijah's going to come. So this is he'll be the harbinger of the Messiah. He's heralding the end of days. He's heralding the saving of the people. So this, this is what they're looking for. We need Elijah to come.

'cause that means the Messiah's coming. Yes. And so they have this place setting at the table and at the very end of the haha, what do they do? What does the whole congregation do? So they all stand as the door is opened. Yes. And they're hoping that that will be the time that Elijah will be there. They can all go out to meet him.

And that their version of the second coming mm-hmm. Is starting. He came The saviors here. So the really cool thing for members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is we also believe that Elijah will come and we believe, if you turn to doctrine in covenants, section 110, let's go there. You wanna cross reference somewhere on Exodus chapter 12, put doctrine and covenants, section 110 and you wanna write verses 13 through 16.

Joseph Smith, he is in the Kirtland Temple. It has been dedicated and it says, after this vision had closed, another great and glorious vision burst upon us. For Elijah, the prophet who is taken to heaven without tasting death stood before us and said, behold, the time has fully come. Which was spoken of by the mouth of Malachi testifying that he, Elijah should be sent before the great and dreadful day of the Lord come to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children and the children to the fathers, lest the whole earth be smitten with a curse.

And Chelsea, tell us what's significant about the day this revelation was received. Okay. There's several things. First of all, this is right after the dedication of the Kirtland Temple. It's been a few days, and it is Easter Sunday. Yes. And it is the second day of Passover. So for people that don't live in Jerusalem, they celebrate two days of Passover to make sure, because it's based on a lunar calendar, they wanna make sure that they are hitting the right day.

So it is during Passover and Easter. Yes. And it's including all of these people that are related to Easter and Ancient Israel. I mean, it's so cool and I love it. He came, it's very fun to do in your homes and you can point and connect to the fact that Elijah has come and he has turned the hearts and he is preparing, like you said, the harbinger of the Messiah.

Yes. He's preparing the way and we're getting ready for Jesus to come again. Oh, this is so cool. It's very exciting. Like it really is. The ancient Israelites, they were just looking for someone to come and we also get to see all of the little pieces of things being fulfilled for him to be coming again.

Oh my goodness. And the very neat thing for all of us is we have this Passover celebration, which is so important and I love so much of it. And then we have our own experience with our membership in this church where we're doing all these things as well. I almost feel like we're having, every time we go to the temple, it's a Passover.

Every time we take the sacrament. Yes, it's a Passover for us. Like we are constantly doing things in preparation for the savior to come on a daily basis and we are waiting for the Messiah to return. And that's what's so exciting about when these days coincide. And so how lucky for us this year we get to have Easter Sunday and Passover very close.

'cause sometimes they're weeks apart, sometimes they fall on the same day. We love that when that happens. But anytime they're close, it's really fun to celebrate and to point out all of these neat things for your family. So we're gonna end with this really cool talk. This is by Elder Suarez in a conference address.

He talked about a Brazilian couple, Mario and Regina Emerick, who had died of COVID just four days apart from each other. And here's what their son said to Elder Suarez. And it just ties in beautifully with Passover and the the savior returning. Will you read this for us, Chelsea? Yes. It was so difficult to see my parents depart from this world in that condition, but I could clearly feel the hand of the Lord in my life, amids that tragedy.

Because I received strength and peace that transcended my understanding through my faith in Jesus Christ and his atonement. I received divine help to strengthen and comfort my family members and all those who helped us during this trying experience, even though the miracle that everyone hoped for not occur personally, I'm a witness of many other miracles that have occurred in my own life and in the lives of my family members.

I felt an inexplicable peace that penetrated the depths of my heart, giving me hope and confidence in the love of the Savior for me, and in the plan of happiness of God for his children. I learned that on the very most grief fill days, the loving arms of the Savior are always extended when we seek him with all our heart, power, mind, and strength.

Thank you. I just wanna say at the end, like Nu, and going back to how you started us, that he specializes in the impossible, and that is. To me the message of Easter and the message of the Passover and how we should just embrace this beautiful holiday coming up that we get to do with our family and friends.

And so gather your thoughts, Chelsea, and is there a takeaway or a spiritual truth you learned from our discussion? Something you were like, oh yeah, I remembered that. Yeah. Something that is I think important to note is that when it comes to any ordinance that God has ever given us, the ordinance isn't what does it.

That participating in a Passover has never been what saved the Israelites or the Jewish people or us partaking of the sacrament isn't what saves us. Getting baptized isn't what cleans us. It is all the symbolism of Jesus Christ. And I really, really liked in that last quote where this man said that he felt hope and confidence in the love of the savior.

To me, that is the message of Passover. That is the message of Easter. That is the message of the atonement of Jesus Christ is that because of him, we can have confidence and hope for ourselves and for our loved ones today, tomorrow, and for Amen. Thank you, Chelsea. Thank you for being on this episode.

Thank you for asking. Well, I just wanna say from our discussion today, because I've kept saying it throughout this whole episode, is Easter and Passover absolutely is a reminder that God and Jesus Christ specialize in the impossible. And so when you eat the foods on the Seder plate, and it's so fun to do with your kids 'cause they get grossed out, but you can remind them of just how bitter it was for the Israelites.

And it's this like, it's bitter for us too. And he helps us all come out on top. That's what's so great about our savior, Jesus Christ and our Heavenly Father. And then again, that word nu And I'm gonna hopefully never forget you singing that. That was the highlight of this episode. Thank you for doing that.

You're the best. Oh, thanks. My pleasure. We're done. That's it. You are so awesome. I just have so much fun. Thank you for letting me participate. We do. I can't believe I just, every time you're on, I learn so much from you. Well, holy moly, what eternal truth did you learn and what stood out to you from this discussion?

So go and join our Facebook group or follow us on Instagram and share what you've learned. And then throughout this week, we're gonna post a question from this discussion. And here's what I wanna know. How are you doing? Or what are you doing to celebrate Easter this year? Comment on the post that relates to this lesson and share your thoughts.

You can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at ldsliving.com slash Sunday on Monday and go there anyway because it's where we're gonna have links to all the references as well as Chelsea Hayden's Passover Kit and a transcript of this whole discussion. So go check it out.

The Sunday on Monday Study Group is a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original, brought to you by LDS Living. It's written and hosted by me, Tammy Uzelac Hall. And today our perfect study group participant was Chelsea Hayden. And you can find more information about my friend at LDS living.com/sunday on Monday.

Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is edited and mixed by Cole Wissinger and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week and please remember Dinu, and you are God's favorite.