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Segment 1
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Who out there enjoys the wilderness? Now maybe wilderness means different things to different people. For instance, the wilderness could be the mountains, the Deseret, a beach. Is your wilderness dark or is it sunny? Is there a water source in your wilderness? And where are you staying in this wilderness?
Are you in a cabin, a tent? And maybe for some of you it's a hotel that's as wilderness as it gets. Well, listen, whatever you imagine, today's wilderness in numbers. Chapters 11 through 14 at 20 through 24 and 27 is wild. And the stories from the wilderness not only teach us life lessons. But the word wilderness, interestingly enough, is a lesson on life.
Welcome to the Sunday, on Monday Study Group, a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original, brought to you by LDS Living where we take the come Follow Me lesson for the week, and we really dig into the scriptures together. I'm your host, Tammy Uzelac Hall. Now, if you're new to our study group, please follow the link in our description and it's going to explain how you can best use this podcast to enhance your come Follow Me study, just like my longtime listening friend, Karen Schrider.
Karen, I loved meeting you at church. Thanks for saying hi to me. And then also her friend Melissa Ryther, they both listen to the podcast and they'd love it. Okay. Now here's the best thing about this podcast is each week we're joined by two of my friends. So it's always a little bit different. And today we have two friends who love each other.
They're related to each other. I'm so excited because we have original OG Becky Farley. Hi back. Well, hey Tam. Good to have you back. Love this woman. Get to be back. And we've been canoodling over the years about having this person on. And then I'm just like, I sat by her at a funeral and then she didn't even have a chance.
'cause I said, well, it looks like you're gonna be on my podcast. It's Kemi Farley. Hi Kemi. Hi Tammy. How did you feel when I asked you to be on the podcast? Oh, well, I'd rather not say. I'm trying to be positive.
Oh my gosh. I love it. Okay. How do you two know each other then? Oh, you go back. Well, the first time I met Kim, I, uh, was I dating Doug for the two seconds that you dated? It was probably at a family party. So we are married to brothers, which is a really interesting relationship. And the first time I met her, I knew we were gonna be best friends.
Aw. I don't think she knew that, but I knew that and I, like, I think I thanked heavenly father at that point. Mm-hmm. Because it sister-in-laws can be a tricky relationship. Right. But I knew the minute I met her, there was no tricky, there was only best friends. Like, it's, it's such a gift I to raise our kids together and know that we're together eternally.
Like I know that sounds crazy, but I'm always gonna be with her. She is always gonna be there, and she is funny and kind and wise and nonjudgmental, and I lucked out. I got, I got so lucky with my sister-in-law. Wow. Wow. Thanks, Becky. It got me crying already. We just started, I've learned so much from Becky.
She's solved many, many of my problems, possibly all of them. She is a truth teller and I, I love that about her. She is really insightful and always knows what's really going on, and she's not afraid to tell you about it. Well, that's the truth. Which is, which is why I love her so much. Shell tell you like, it is.
That's why we're friends. But it is a really easy relationship and, and it's one of the best relationships I have. Becky. Well, I can see why you felt that way, Becky. 'cause the first time I met Kimi, she was so kind. She's, she reintroduced herself to me. And I was like, whoa. And then I remember thinking, oh, we would be friends, for sure.
Mm-hmm. So it was, it was so easy for me to say, oh, I want you to be on the podcast. Let's do this with Becky. So, yeah. I, everybody, everybody wants to be friends with Keem, everybody. I get that. Totally believe it. Oh, stop it. Okay. We're done. I think this took too farleys. Too Farleys, too Farleys. Are you, are you gonna do that?
On the podcast today. Well, I'll call her Kimi, but you're gonna be Farley. You're always Farley. So Farley will be Becky, but Kimi will be Kimi. So there we go. That's how I'll differentiate between the two of you. It did take me a long time to figure out how to say her name. Oh really? Because it was it Kimi Uhhuh.
Yeah. Kimie. Mm-hmm. Yeah, Kimmy. And tell the truth. You were not happy about having to say that for the rest of your life. Oh gosh, no. No. I had to practice it. It was so dumb. Ridiculous. I know. And And you were like, it's key me. Key me. I'm like, oh good. Thanks for letting me practice that. Practice it for a long time.
That's hilarious. Nice color key. Kii. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Okay. Well, if all of you now wanna know what my guests look like and what Kii looks like, you're gonna wanna check out their bios, which are in our show notes, and they're gonna have pictures there. So go and check those out. That's LD at lds living.com/sunday on Monday.
So everyone grab your scriptures and something to mark them with for sure. And let's turn to the book of numbers. Here we go. Alright, you two. Before we even get started, what is something that the Holy Ghost taught you as you were preparing for this episode? Okay, I'll go first. All right. Kimi, what do you got?
The Holy Ghost was reminding me all week how much I complain and how and how, um, ungrateful I can be. And reading these scriptures is, it was so funny because you just go really? People, why are you complaining so much? And you understand how, how God is so. You know, just has had it with them. And then I just kept being reminded all week, well, who do you sound like?
Mm-hmm. You sound a little bit like the Israelites. So it was, it's been really great, really helpful for me to become more aware of my attitude. Um, so anyway, I, uh, right off the bat in chapter 11, they're, they're complaining and they get, they get burnt up for it, and then right after they get burnt up, well, I don't know if it happens chronologically that way, but the next verse, they immediately start again.
And the mixed multitude that was among them fell a lusting. And the children of Israel also wept again and said, who shall give us flush to eat? We remember the fish, which we did eat in Egypt freely, the cucumbers and the melons and the leeks, and the onions and the garlic. Doesn't that sound like us?
Yeah. Don't remember when things were so great. So much better. Anyway, I, I loved it. The lesson for me was that, um, you know, we, we do that so much, but we forget to see how things are so much better. We, we romanticize the past. Mm-hmm. And forget to, to remember how much better, you know, we're in a better place.
Ooh, I like that. I gotta write that down. We do romanticize the past and so did they. 'cause I'm like, sure they had garlic, but they were enslaved. They were slaves. Oh my gosh. I'm gonna write that down. That's great. What about you, Farley? Oh yeah. Well, I'm with Kim. This is complaining chapters. So that was interesting that you assigned us this tam.
Well, I'm not saying anything Farley, but I'm saying something. No, I'm just kidding. But. You know, there is so much like of God's love. And so I think I took heart on that, that yeah, we're all complaining, but gosh, God still loves us like a whiny little 2-year-old. I mean, you know, we, he's still gonna pick us up and love us and care for us, despite the fact that we're throwing tantrums, you know, about everything left and right.
So my scriptures came from numbers 13 and 14, and I love the story of Joshua and Caleb. Oh, tell. And in fact, that's why I named Caleb. Caleb after this, Caleb, because they're the only adults that get to go in. Because of their faith. Mm-hmm. And because they believed it. And this is where it sort of starts with that.
So everyone's whining about the promised land and they're like, how are we going to get in? It's so terrible and there's so many mean people and we're going to get killed and it's so scary. And then while they're complaining in numbers 13 verse 30, and Caleb stilled the people before Moses and said, let us go up at once and possess it for we are well able to overcome it.
That sentence right there for we are well able to overcome it. Wow. And I think that that's how we roll. Like we think, oh, I just don't think I knew it. Yeah, you can. Get up, you can do it. It's okay. You can do it. I hear, I hear my mom's voice. My mom passed away a couple years ago and I hear her voice all the time just laughing and saying, it's okay, Becky.
You can do it. You can do it. And then in numbers 14, here's Joshua talking verse six 14, and Joshua, the son of none, and Caleb, the son of, uh, Jina, which were of them that searched the land, rent their clothes and they speak unto all the company of the children of Israel saying the land which we passed through to search it, is an exceedingly good land.
And I'm thinking what they meant by that is, yeah, it's gonna be tough. It's gonna be hard. Eight. If the Lord delight in us, then he will bring us unto this land and give it us a land which floweth with milk and honey only rebel, not ye, against the Lord. Neither fear ye the people of the land, for they are bred for us.
Their defense is departed from them and the Lord is with us. Fear them, not the Lord is with us. Fear them not. And for we are well able to overcome it. That's what I learned. That's what I learned too from you. Thank you for pointing that out. Oh my gosh. Well, you know I love a positive swing. I'm a little bit of a Pollyanna.
You are. Definitely because in this storyline, back in numbers 13, after you read verse 30, I have 31 highlighted. 'cause the men say, we're, but we're not able to go up against the people for they're stronger than we are. Like as soon as Caleb says we could do this, then all the people are like, no, we can't.
Nope, nope. We're not gonna do it. And I just think it's interesting in the next time, like, no, we, the land's great. You're gonna love it. And the thing that blows my mind about all of this is how much I love these two men, these two spies, and I'm gonna tell you why in the next segment. But if they were able to go into the Promised land and come back, there's no mention of how short of a time it took to get there when the children of Israel are gonna wander forever.
Like that's, oh yeah. Mm-hmm. Like when he's like, no, let's go. We can do this. You can see why the Lord didn't let them do that, because the children of Israel were complaining like, nah, we can't. And the Lord's like, would you just believe in me? Well, and it reminds me of that quote. Whether you believe you can or whether you believe you can't.
You're right. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, you just see that so clearly. It's like, yeah, okay. Just believe it and then we can do it. But if you say, nah, I want my garlic and my fish and my cucumbers and melons. Yeah, back to slavery. Go do this. Go to Deuteronomy chapter one. Here's how long it actually should have taken them to get from point A to point B.
And Joshua and Caleb, they just walk over to the promised land and see it. 'cause it did not take very much time. The children of Israel are gonna wander, but look at Deuteronomy chapter one and all you wanna do is look at verse two. Will you read verse two? Farley. There are 11 days journey from hob, by the way, of Mount Sear unto Kadesh Baria.
How many days should it have taken? 11 days. That's it. It took him 40 years. Sorry. Crazy. 'cause to Kadesh Barney is on the outside, almost close to Canaan. And so when Joshua, it's, it's interesting. Think about it. When Moses sends them to the Promised Land, they weren't gone for 40 years. They were gone for a couple days and then they came back and they're like, we saw it.
It's amazing. We could totally take it. And they're like, nah, we don't. Well, we can't do it. God can't help us. And so he's like, well, you're gonna wander. I, I've never known that it was only supposed to take 'em 11 days. Yeah. If they had been ready to go and had listened to the Lord and had been, in fact, go back to verse nine, only Rebel.
Rebel. Not against the Lord, neither fear the people of the land. For they are bred to us. Their defense is departed from them and the Lord is with us. Fear them not. And then look what verse 10 says. Read verse 10. But all the congregation bathed, stoned them with stones. And the glory of the Lord appeared in the tabernacle of the congregation before all the children of Israel.
Can you imagine all I'm like, just stone 'em. Stone, Joshua and Caleb. What do they know? You know? Yeah. They're like, we were just there. And then Kimi read verse 18 and 19. 'cause this is the Lord, the Lord that you both have talked about. And I think it's perfect that Kimi iss reading this, the Lord is long suffering and of great mercy for giving iniquity and transgression.
And by no means clearing the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation. Pardon? I beseech thee the iniquity of these people according unto the greatness of thy mercy. And as thou has forgiven this people from Egypt, even until now. I love that the Lord is, and I think in 20, and the Lord said, I have pardoned according to thy word.
Like, all right, here we go. Well, guess we're gonna take some time here in the wilderness until you guys can figure it out. 40 years. That so crazy. Well, when I, when I read that they were going, they, you know, they went into the land, I, it took me a while to realize, oh, that's the promised land, because they were right next to it the whole time.
So I didn't expect it to happen like that fast. So crazy. Not that fast. It was a long, long time. But they were so close. Yes. And nobody connected that like, wait, how did you, you got there so quick. Oh, all right. Yeah. Maybe they did connect it though. Maybe that was more of the frustration. Oh, but were they just caught up in their, caught up in their own heads.
With all of it. Great question. You. That's interesting to think maybe they did connect it and thought, well, we're, we're not ready to go. There's no way we could fight them. They'll kill us here. We're safe. We're safe in our little wilderness. We're, we're, we're safe together and we don't wanna grow and we don't want, we don't want what we wanna promise.
That's a life lesson right there. That's what we end up doing. We would rather stay in our muck. Mm-hmm. We would rather eat our manna instead of our cucumbers because we're, we can't see past, we we're looking past it. We can't see it. Well or not appreciate the manna, not just appreciate it and, and know that, okay.
Well, yeah. But they could have, they could have just gone to the promised land and not had to eat the manna that they were so mad about. Yeah. 11 days later. Okay. That's just what Holy cow. I mean, that's just what the Holy Ghost taught you guys. We had the greatest discussion. That is awesome. Okay, so let's talk about the book of numbers then.
Let's go all the way back to numbers chapter one, and we're gonna talk about the significance of that name and what this whole book is really about, and we'll do that next.
Segment 2
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Let's go to the book of numbers. That's where we're gonna be. And I just want you to be on the page that says, the fourth book of Moses called Numbers. Hey, Tam, can I ask a quick question? Yeah. Why is it called the book of Numbers? WI didn't even, okay, just for the record. I did not tell Farley to ask me that.
I'm gonna tell you that's exactly what I'm doing right now. This is so cool. Okay. Okay. Oh my gosh, Farley. Nice job. Okay, here's why it's called the Book of Numbers, because in Hebrew it's a completely different name. In the Hebrew Bible, it is not called the Book of Numbers. I wanna show you something very cool.
The books of the Old Testament in Hebrew are different than the English King James version because the names in Hebrew come from almost the first verse of each book. So, for instance, go with me to Genesis chapter one. I'm gonna show you what the name of the book of Genesis is in Hebrew 'cause it's not Genesis highlight in the beginning and in the Hebrew Old Testament.
The book of Genesis is called Betty Sheet, which means in the beginning. Can you spell that? Tim? Yeah. B-E-R-E-I-S-H-I-T. So it's bed sheet, the book of in the beginning, 'cause it comes from the first sentence. Let's go to Exodus chapter one and I'll show you what the book of Exodus is called in Hebrew.
Okay. The book of Exodus is actually called Shemot, S-H-E-M-O-T. And here's where it comes from in the very first verse. Now these are the names of the children of Israel. So the book of Exodus is actually called The Book of Names. Oh, Shamo Shamo is plural for the word name. So names. Okay. Let's go to Leviticus.
I'll show you what the book of Leviticus in Hebrew is called, and then we'll get to numbers. Okay. Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus. And if it comes from the very first verse, I'm gonna see if you can guess, what do you think the book of Leviticus is called From the first verse at the beginning. The Lord called.
Yes. And in Hebrew that is Vara. It's spelled V-A-Y-I-K-R-A. That's how you translate. And he called vara. Now let's turn to numbers chapter one and let's find out what it's really called in Hebrew, and then why it's called numbers in English. If you go to numbers chapter one, verse one, in Hebrew, it's actually the book of Ba Mead bar, which in verse one it says, and the Lord speak into Moses in the wilderness.
Highlight in the wilderness. That's the name of this book. Book. Oh, that's what I'm gonna guess. You were gonna guess that kimmi. Yeah, you would've been right in the wilderness. And the way you say that in Hebrew is ba mead bar Ba means in and mead bar is wilderness. So BA is ba. Then MID. BAR me bar. So now this book is actually gonna set it up and say, oh, this is the book of in the wilderness things that are going on in the wilderness as we begin these journeys in the wilderness.
Well, and I love that first, the first four and the Lord spa in the wilderness. Right? I mean that's, that's kind of beautiful, especially when we discover what the word wilderness means. We're gonna, I wanna come back to that Farley, then I want you to connect that to what we're going to learn about the word wilderness.
'cause this is gonna be awesome. So hold that thought. Let's go to where it's called the Book of Numbers in the English translation, and here's why it's called the Book of Numbers, because in this book. What Moses is going to do is he's going to take an an accounting or a number, look at verse two, take the sum of all the congregation of the families, of the children of Israel and their families by the house of their fathers with the number of their names, every male by their polls from 20 years old and upward.
All that are able to go forth to war in Israel, that thou Aaron May number them by their armies. So we're gonna number all those that are capable of going to war and fighting. And then you go to verse 19 as the Lord commanded Moses. So he numbered them in the wilderness of Sinai, and that's where we get the name numbers.
So he is gonna number all the families. Oh, okay. So if you take a highlighter and you go through the book of numbers, chapter one, you're going to see all of their names. So in verse 20, I've highlighted Reuben right there in verse 22, I've highlighted Simeon. And at the end of each verse, it tells us how many there are.
Verse 24 is Gad. Highlight that name. Verse 26 is Judah. Verse 28 is Issachar. Verse 30 is Zebulon. So highlight that name. Verse 32 is Joseph. Verse 34 is Manasses. Verse 36 is Benjamin. Verse 38. The children of, there's Dan. Verse 40 is Asher. Verse 42 is Naftali. And then. There's no accounting of the Levites.
It's the only tribe that is not part of the accounting. And that says right here at the end in verse 46, it says, even all they that were numbered were 600,000, 3,550, but the Levites after the tribe of their fathers were not numbered among them. And here's why. They are the group or the tribe that will not go to war.
So it was only counted those who could fight, and they are going to be over the tabernacle. That's their responsibility. So they were not counted in the census. All right, so now we have this book of numbers. What do you think? Is that so fun? Yeah, that's really cool. I did not know all of that. Yeah, I like that.
I think that's a good name for it. I agree. 'cause boy you guys are gonna share with us today some crazy stories that come out of the book of numbers or out of the wilderness. Right. Crazy stuff going on in the wilderness, for sure. Mm-hmm. So one of the things I said at the very beginning is, and did you like how I said that?
I'm like stories from the wilderness that not only teach us life lessons, but the word wilderness is actually a lesson on life. Ah, thank you. I know I wrote like that. That was very, I'm gonna stitch that on a pillow. Go ahead. Go ahead. So you, these two have today have prepared these really great life lessons to learn from the book of numbers or the book of the wilderness.
But one of the things that I think is so cool is I wanna talk about wilderness really quickly before we dive into the stories. Because the thing that blows my mind is that the word wilderness appears so many times in scripture. I did just a quick search and I added up as fast as I could. And here's what I found, and I'm sure there's gonna be a little bit of error, but I thought this was neat.
In the Bible, the word wilderness appears 293 times. In the Book of Mormon, the word wilderness appears at least 252 times. And in the doctrine and covenants it appears about 17 times. And this, and I thought that was so fascinating because the word appears roughly 563 times in. All of scripture. And the thing that's neat about wilderness is that every story, it's either about people going into the wilderness, going through the wilderness, or getting out of the wilderness.
For example, here's a few, Adam and Eve driven out into the wilderness. We have Moses and the children of Israel who will be in the wilderness for 40 years. Lehigh Sariah and her family, they're gonna be in the wilderness. And we love those chapters that talk about women giving birth in the wilderness and eating raw meat and surviving Alma, the elders in the wilderness, the son of Mosiah, the brother of Jared, and even Jesus Christ.
We'll fast for 40 days and 40 nights in the wilderness. Now this is so cool because when we talk about the Israelites and they were so excited to finally leave enslavement right to leave, how hard life was. And I love Kimmi that you pointed out how quickly they forgot because now they're like, you know, our food was way better in Egypt.
Like we could have just gone back, we'd be having garlic. Okay, so. I love that you shared that. That makes me so happy. They knew though, that they wanted to leave Egypt to get to the promised land, the land flowing with milk and honey. In Exodus chapter three, verse eight literally says that the Lord says to Moses, I'm gonna have you lead these children to the land flowing with milk and honey.
And so they know where they wanna leave and they know where they wanna get to, but in order to do that, they had to go through the wilderness. There's no way you can't go around it. You have to absolutely go through the wilderness. So I have this really cool quote. It's by the Rabbi Stephen Kushner, and here's what he has to say about the word wilderness Farley, will you read this quote from him?
If you want to leave your Egypt and get to your promised land, you have to be willing to traverse wilderness. Mid bar is a place of nothing. It is empty. There are no guarantees in wilderness, no assurances. It can be scary. It is a place of wandering which can at times feel endless, but it is also a place of discovery.
Mid bar from the root debar. Uhhuh, which is also the root for word in Hebrew, is where Torah, God's word is found. Wilderness is where we meet God. Wilderness is where we encounter ourself. It is the place of growth and there's no getting around it. Mid bar is the only way to the promised land. It is a sacred place.
Alright, Farley. Talk to me about that. Okay. I know your mind is spinning and Kei jump in. I'm thinking about how much wilderness I encountered on my mission. Mm. And how. I, I was a, I was a complainer. I was complaining about not getting garlic and melons and cucumbers and whatever else. And I wanted, um, I wanted things to be different.
I wanted to be, have it be fun and happy and instead it was hard and difficult. And at the end, and I probably will share a story later on, 'cause I know that, that we're gonna talk a little bit more about that. But it wasn't until I had the radical acceptance of wilderness, of the fact that this is, this is difficult.
And it's okay. It won't be difficult forever, but you're gonna be a better person because of it. You're gonna understand my love because of it. That didn't come until halfway through my mission. Like I spent half of my mission kind of complaining and saying, but it's not fun. And I think I've spent a lot of time in my life, whether it's, you know, schooling or marriage, you know, maybe that's been a little difficult at times.
Or definitely raising children, whatever it is. And I just wish that, I wish that I could remember this concept of, but it's gonna be better. It's gonna be good. It's okay for you to do this. You've got enough strength. Just power through and remember God and how much he loves you, and that you're gonna get something good from it.
Don't you think that's something we get better at? Like, I, at least for me, you know, with aging comes wisdom and, and now I'm good and old, but I've, I'm so much more tolerant of the wilderness than I used to be. You know, because I've, I've done it so many times, I'm like, yeah, this is, this isn't very fun And forever auto now I don't think, oh, I like tolerant.
I, I think that depends on the thing. Nice. I mean, wait, don't get me wrong. I will be complaining the whole time, but I will also know that it's not gonna last forever and that we'll get through it. Yes. And Becky, you actually told me one time in a remember, I'll always remember it because it was a gift you pointed out that I never would've realized.
But you said you're, you told me that I was really good at waiting things out, that I was good at patience and I am, but I also complain the whole time. That's how I, that's how I cope with, with, with the wilderness. That's how you cope with it. It. It is. I am such a complainer. Yeah. I'm gonna try and do better, but anyway, but I do, I do have a good perspective, I think, and, and the older I get, the better that perspective gets, because you can kind of been through it.
Yeah. You've been through some wilderness and Oh yeah. Recognize it. I think that's so great. Kimi. The idea of then when, when you meet people in the wilderness who are younger and are going through things, you can be like, oh, let me tell you my experience. Listen, you're gonna be fine. Yeah. It's, it's all good.
It's, it's all good. Because I think sometimes we think wildernesses are isolated moments, but the reality is, is this life is the wilderness. Yeah. All of it. From the moment you're born until you, because we left the presence of our heavenly father and heavenly mother. And the goal, our land of flowing with milk and honey is to return.
It's not a bonus. It's not a better job. It's not to live in a bigger house. Like I think we focus that the land of milk and honey is to return to God. So this is wilderness, all of it. That is really interesting. But I do think what you're saying came about age. I think that's why I always hear my mom's voice Mm.
Saying to me. Mm-hmm. It's okay. This is kind of funny. You should laugh about it. This story's gonna be funny one day. You know, I mean, 'cause I do think that it's perspective and age and, and, and knowing that of course this life is gonna be hard. Like what did you expect? Yeah. Right. We know that we come here, we know that life is gonna be hard 'cause it was designed to be, and then we're so mad when it is.
Oh, I love that. Kimi. Even though we, that's what we're here for. We are mad when this Okay. Do this then go to numbers chapter 14 and we're gonna end with this verse 33 and 34, because they've had the experience. I'm sure they're sick and tired of j Joshua and Caleb saying, you guys just quick trip. We can get there tomorrow.
Like, or in a couple of days. Let's just do this. We can fight 'em. Come on. And they're just so awful. And they wanted to stone them and all the things that, the Lord says this to them in numbers Chapter 14, verse 33 and 34, Kemi, will you read that for us? Sure. And your children shall wander in the wilderness 40 years and bury your hams until your carcasses be wasted in the wilderness.
After the number of days in which you search the land, even 40 days each day for a year, shall you bury your inequities even 40 years, and you shall know my breach of promise. Highlight the number 40 there 40 years because I love this number so much. Yes, they could have absolutely traversed the wilderness for literally 40 years.
And the number 40 in scripture is symbolic of a test or a trial. Mm-hmm. I also add my interpretation, the time it takes to learn a lesson. And so we, right now, and I always joke and I, every time I get to teach this, I'm like, raise your hand if you're still in your forties. Like, I've been in my forties forever.
It doesn't matter what your age is. You know, we are just the time it takes to learn the, the test or trial period of life. And so that's what they'll do for 40 years, trying to learn over and over again. But the Lord will still, he's like, you'll see my promise. I, I'm promising you this and I'm gonna be so patient with you.
Just like you guys said, the Lord is patient and he loves us even when we're complainers. So thanks for your answers, and that was a great discussion. Okay, so then let's do this in the next segment, let's dig into some of these really great stories or life lessons from the wilderness. And we'll start with the first story in the next segment.
Segment 3
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I have a fun question for you two. Tell me everything you think of when you hear this term riffraff. Describe if someone says, boy, what They bought a bunch of riff. That's riffraff. What? What are we talking about? Oh, I, I think it means like confusion or kind of crazy and a little bit that people are not following the rules.
They're, they're going against it a little bit, I think of Aladdin. He was called Ruth Wr. Yes. Like the outcast, like the not good enough people who aren't good enough. I don't know if that's right, but that's what I thought of. Well, I like how you said that Aladdin, because he was a rule breaker, he was stealing.
Like for sure. But he was doing it for a good reason. He was kind of the Robinhood riffraff. Right. Very good. Okay, these are all good answers. Now. I love this because this is such a cool application. Let's turn to numbers. Chapter 11. We're gonna look at verses one through four. And Kimi, you did such a great job of introducing us to this concept, which we've referred to many times, but there is a connection to the word riffraff that I think is so fun.
Okay? In numbers chapter 11, I will read verse one, and when the people complained, it displeased the Lord. And the Lord heard it, and his anger was kindled and the fire of the Lord burnt among them and consumed them that were in the uttermost parts of the camp. Kimi, you did a great job of explaining that to us, like, okay, the Lord, come on, stop complaining.
Now, let's keep reading the story. And Kimi, will you read verse two and Becky verse three? Sure. Verse two. And the people cried unto Moses. And when Moses prayed unto the Lord, the fire was quenched. And he called the name of the place tab because the fire of the Lord burnt among them. And then verse four and the mixed multitude, highlight that right there.
And the mixed multitude that was among them fell a lusting. And the children of Israel also wept again and said, who shall give us flesh to eat? Mixed multitude in the Hebrew translation literally translates as riffraff. Is that so fun? So the riffraff that was among them fell a lusting, like they're just up to no good.
They're naughty. Right? This, I just thought that was so funny. And everything I've read from all scholarship in Hebrew says it really is riffraff. And the thing with the riffraff is that now when you read it. The riffraff that was among them fell lusting. And the children of Israel also wept again and said, who will give us flesh to eat?
The whole point of this is the riffraff. They were able to get others to join them in their murmuring. Like they had the ability to say, you know, he just burned a bunch of people for complaining. You think they'd learn their lesson, right? Mm-hmm. And they, they didn't, they, the, the riff wrap turns around and says, you know what?
No. Okay, well then fine. We're still hungry. And what are we gonna do about food? And then we get into the verse. Kimi, read the one that you read for us before in verse five. We remember the fish, which we did eat in Egypt freely, the cucumbers and the melons, and the leeks, and the onions and the garlic. And then Farley Reed, verse six.
Now our soul is dried away. There is nothing at all beside this manana before our eyes. You read that perfectly? Yes. I just, you can hear them right, like, we're sick of a manna. We're sick to death. There's this concept in, um, Buddhism about an empty ghost. And an empty ghost has a swollen stomach and this mouth that you can never fill it up.
It's like shriveled up, but the stomach is like swollen so big because they've eaten and eaten and eaten, but they're never filled. Oh, and it all comes from this concept of being of, of you. Can you have everything? God gives us everything. Yes. That's not enough. It's the non satisfaction that kills us. In the end.
The not being satisfied. Will kill us. We need to be satisfied with what God has given us. And it's hard, I was thinking about that with, with, um, I find myself saying, oh, this stupid phone a smartphone. So funny. If you think about, yeah, yeah. The first time we got a smartphone, it was like, you know, it was, our lives were complete and we were gonna be happy for the rest of our lives.
Oh. And then five months in, ugh, this stupid, stupid phone. I wish I could get a new one. Or, what am I gonna make for dinner? And my whole fridge is full. What the heck am I gonna make for dinner? Which is too full, but I've got 80 million choices. Or, or, you know, what am I gonna wear? I hate all this things in my closet.
You know, it's like when my, my 14-year-old daughter said. I've never even been on a cruise.
Right. Yeah. Keep me. I love the phone one though, because I immediately had this image me, of me sitting in my apartment with my roommates and we all had times in the night where we got to be on the, on the computer 'cause we had to dial up. And it took forever to dial into my account at my bank just to do pay my bills.
And I can remember sitting there going, oh. Oh, this takes so long. Not even knowing how fast it would be. Eventually one day and now I'm there. And you're right, I do say, oh, this stupid phone. I can't believe how how slow it is. And it's like a new nanosecond need new one. Yeah. I need, need a new one. 'cause it's not as fast.
And I for I have forgotten the dial up days. I have forgotten my, what it was like to be in Egypt, how hard it was to get on the internet. Oh my gosh. I love that so much. Okay, everything you've just described is the story in numbers chapter 11 because they're like, we want better food. And the Lord's like, you won't stop complaining.
Okay fine. You want food? I'm gonna give you quail. In fact, I'm gonna give you so much quail. Let's go to numbers chapter 11 and read verse 20. 'cause it's so perfect. Farley. I love how you're reading. So read verse 24, us. But even a whole month until it come out at your nostrils and it be loathsome unto you because that ye have despised the Lord, which is among you and have wept before him saying, why can't we forth out of Egypt?
Can you imagine? Imagine having come out of their nostrils, you're gonna have so much, you're not gonna know what to do with it all. Yeah. Like you want quail. Oh, I'll give you quail. You bet. I'll give you quail. So let's go to that story then In numbers chapter 11. Let's read verses 31 through 34. We'll each take a verse and then I'll have us mark some things and we'll, we'll finish up this story about abundance.
Okay, go ahead and we'll go Far Lemi than me. And there went forth the wind from the Lord and brought quails from the sea and let them fall by the camp as it were. A day's journey on this side and as it were, a day's journey on the other side, roundabout the camp and as it were, two qubits high upon the face of the earth.
Highlight two cubits high. Just so you know, that's three feet deep. Oh, that's how much quail there were. A lot of quail. Like a spot. Yeah. Just your wa, everywhere you walk, quail comes up to, well, Farley, you're short comes up to your hips. Oh, you're not that short, but thanks. I am three feet high. That's crazy.
That's a lot of quail. Mm-hmm. Okay. 32. Mm-hmm. And the people stood up all that day and all that night and all the next day, and they gathered the quails, he that gathered lease gathered 10 homers and they spread them all abroad for themselves. Roundabout the camp. While the flesh was yet between their teeth air, it was chewed.
The wrath of the Lord was kindled against the people. And the Lord Smo the people with a very grievous plague. And he called the name of that place Kib Roth Hava. Because there they buried the people that lusted. And then look at the footnote for the name of the place they called it. It literally in Hebrew means the graves of the lust.
Now what's the life lesson there? Lesson from the wilderness. You get what you get 'cause God will give it to you. God will give it to you. And, and appreciation and satisfaction. You can be happy with what you have. It's just, you know, making up your mind and maybe just moderation. Mm-hmm Which is hard sometimes when things are plentiful.
Hmm. Wow. Aren't they though? Do either of you have an experience in your life about this? Or know someone. I have a personal example about that when. I went back to school a few years ago and a lot of, you know, there's a lot of liberal classes and stuff and social media too influenced this. But I, I started having a lot of just like, dissatisfactions and, and getting ideas from other people and about things that, you know, to be bugged by, I guess, about the church.
And in some ways this was really healthy for me 'cause I did a lot of examining of my beliefs and what I'd been taught and it was really good for me. But after a while, I, I felt that I was just critiquing every single thing and deciding if it was like, if that was the way it should be or if that was good enough and um, or if that should be different.
And it was kind of exhausting. I realized after a few years of doing that, that it was wearing on me. And so I transitioned into this, I call it my trust era, where I'm just trusting God and I'm just letting that stuff go and it's so, so nice to just. Trust God and not question every single thing and just be grateful for the knowledge that I have and the blessings that I have and my covenants and all of the beautiful things in the gospel.
And so now the, that's my focus and it's just so much happier than when my focus was to decide if I approved of things, if I approved everything. That's awesome. Oh my gosh, I love that. I wrote that down on my scriptures. Your trust era. Mm-hmm. I was thinking of mine because here's my experience is for years and years and years, I prayed to get married and have kids.
That was my prayer. Absolutely. I should have been specific, get married, then have kids. But I prayed to get married and have kids and I got 'em in the same day. And I'm telling you what, add quail's coming outta my nose. Like that was the hardest thing I ever did. And then I found myself on my closet crying my eyeballs out that I made a mistake and that maybe I shouldn't have done this.
And that was way harder than I thought it was. I mean, it was real. And And Farley, you remember that? Like I was struggling. It was so hard to be a mom. Yeah. And I really came close to checking out and just being like, you can't do this. And it was at that moment that God taught me one of the best lessons that I have since taught my daughters, which is when you get what you pray for, you don't get to complain about it.
Like. You prayed for this and you got it. So figure it out. Because I think that's where it turns into lusting is, and that's where we end up becoming the graves of the those is this that like, I imagine them having so much quail that then they're like, no, it's too much. And the Lord's just like, well, I can't win with you.
Because never at any point in those verses did we see that the people fell to their na knees and gave thanks to the Lord that they did have quail coming out of their noses. That's the point, is that rather than being grateful for what they got, they lusted ever, they lusted to the point where it caused them to die.
And I just think of my life, like, I'm grateful I didn't die in my closet when I was complaining to God. He could have so easily been like, I'm done with you, but he let me just figure it out like, you got what you wanted and now figure it out. And I then I, I quickly turned from absolute like, this is so hard to Okay.
I'm grateful. Yeah. And, and I can do this. Yeah. Okay. I love this quote from Elder Reland in April, 2016 that he gave in general conference the concept quote, the greater the distance between the giver and the receiver, the more the receiver develops. A sense of entitlement, unquote, also has profound spiritual applications.
Our heavenly father and his son Jesus Christ, are the ultimate givers. The more we distance ourselves from them, the more entitled we feel. We begin to think that we deserve grace and are owed blessings. We are more prone to look around, identify iniquities, and feel aggrieved even offended by the unfairness we perceive.
While the unfairness can range from trivial to gut wrenching, when we are distant from God, even small iniquities loom large, we feel that God has an obligation to fix things and fix them right now. Perfection. And that's what they felt like. Ugh, now we have too much quail. First we had to eat manna. Now it's too much quail and that's, I mean, I have felt so entitled in my life and I really mm-hmm.
Spend so much time repenting of that. Repenting of, oh, heavenly Father. I know. I should be grateful. I know. But that lusting, and I've never thought about that concept of lusting. Mm-hmm. In this way before. I just think of it sexually. Right. It is lusting after a better iPhone. It's lusting after a better life.
And man, are we in the middle of it right now with Instagram and, and Facebook and all, and Snapchat and all the social media. Oh, wow. Because all we are seeing is everybody's good. And then we're like, well, I don't I, my stupid couch, my crappy, my crappy house, my crappy relationship, my crappy whatever. Wow.
And it is exactly what we need for the time, and we have to wake up somehow. Throw our stupid phones away, whatever it means, and save our relationships and save our souls. Don't you think we do that in the church too? We, we, um, we're so blessed and we have this knowledge that gives us so much peace, and then we want more and we want our problem solved faster and we want things to come to be better and, mm.
I was just thinking about how we call, you know, the phone thing we call first world problems, and then I was thinking we have a lot of latter day saint problems too, that are just, that are just trivial, but we're, we're so blessed mm-hmm. That we, we become entitled and we want to be blessed more and blessed faster.
Wow. That's so good. You too. Oh my gosh. Well, and I think it's a good exercise to think of what you are lusting after. Absolutely. I think that that's a, a good exercise. Like what is it that I am dissatisfied with? Is it? Is it a relationship? Is it my house or my couch or my phone or my whatever, whatever it is.
And then find a way to feel gratitude for that thing. And I think that that would make your relationship with God closer at that point. Yeah. I feel like that would, that gratitude for, wow, you have given me everything that I need right now. Mm-hmm. And why in the world do we expect if this world is wilderness, if this world equals wilderness, why do we expect to get out of it?
Like it's okay, we can stay in it and feel grateful. Joshua, Caleb did it. Yeah, absolutely. And like even like we all do it. That's what makes me feel better about it. Like Nephi did it. And the so because we look at the children of Israel, but then yeah, Nephi did too. And we all do that. Oh, life was so much better when, and the reality is is no, it's good now.
And then check yourself. What are you lusting after? What are you expecting to be answered quickly? All the answers. I wrote them all. So good. What has social media convinced you of that you need more of so that you have it coming outta your nostrils? 'cause you gotta be careful, right? I just think it's so good.
So everything you said, what a great discussion on just that story in those chapters. So that's just one story in the wilderness. 'cause there are more. And so in the next segment, here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna talk about a lesson about rules in the wilderness and we'll see how they apply to us.
We'll do that next.
Segment 4
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Now. All right, you two. I have a question again, another question. So when you tour are in the wilderness or if you've ever been in the wilderness, do you have rules for your kids? Yeah, um, I would say know where you're at. Try, try, try to remember where you're at. If you're heading off to the bathroom or you're going down to the lake to go fish or whatever it is, like take a look back and remember the way.
Good one. Yeah. I just need to be with someone who knows better than I do. That's good too. Come get Mac. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, there's so many fun things to think about when you're in the wilderness, depending on what your wilderness is and the rules, certainly when I go camping there is when we pull into the campsite, a posting of all the rules they have at the campsite, the do's and the don'ts, things to be aware of, like I'm super duper grateful for that.
I often wonder if the children of Israel would've benefited from that, right when they're walking in. If there could have been a big sign that says, here's what you're gonna need to know, but the Lord's gotta teach it to these people. And so they've got rules in the wilderness, and Kimi is gonna share a story with us about someone that broke a rule in the wilderness, and the Lord isn't messing around when it comes to his rules.
There's harsh consequences for breaking the roof. Harsh. Like, first of all, we know if you're a complainer, you're getting burned. So that would go on your board. Do not complain, the Lord will burn you. Yeah. What's another rule? Can you tell us this story? Give us the chapter and verses and all the fun stuff?
Okay. This is in numbers 15, ch uh, verses 32 through 36. And as a preface in Exodus in 31 14 through 17, it talks about how breaking the Sabbath day will get you put to death. So, uh, the children of Israel were in the wilderness and they found a man who was gathering sticks upon the Sabbath day. And so they took him and they brought him and put him in a holding place.
And because they weren't sure what to do about it, and the Lord said to Moses, here's the rule. You have to be put to death. And, and he told all the congregation to stone him. And they did. They stoned him and he died. Oh. It's so sad that so Old Testament. And they did. And they did. And he died. And he died.
I love how you said that. So Old Testament, because you read that story and you're like, where's the mercy and grace? Why do you think the Lord made him follow through in the wilderness? I'm so conflicted about this story. I don't like that kind of Old Testament stuff. Um, so I'm Why you're signed me. This one.
I was just like, I don't like it. Oh, I'm glad I did. Then tell me your thoughts. What have you been thinking about it? It's just so harsh, but okay. I, I guess the reasoning is that, that God meant it. Yeah. And the people needed to realize, I guess, being made an example of this is what happens if you break the Sabbath day.
Mm-hmm. That's great input. What about you, Farley? I think that that's a, that's a rough story. Uh, yeah. The, the Lord follows through, and I don't really understand that. I don't understand that part of the Old Testament where it's, it does feel so harsh. Mm-hmm. And I don't know if there's like translation things or I don't know, but I do think that the Lord, what you, what I learned from it is that the Lord follows through.
Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I have to have faith that also, there's the other, there's the other piece of it that he has the love and the care and all of that. Mm-hmm. But sometimes it's hard to see that in the Old Testament with stories like this. Absolutely. It is to think that God would be a man of his word. You want him to believe that when it's in your favor.
You don't wanna believe it when it's someone you know or love. I think one of the things I've learned through this story, and the next story I'm gonna share you is God is consistent and he's no respecter of persons. I don't think I really fully understood what that meant till I read this story. And then the next one, so the next story is turned to numbers chapter 20, because here's what happens after this man is stoned.
Then we go through the story. Miriam Moses's sister dies, and then the children of Israel, they get really thirsty like we have. So all things happen. We have a plague that happens and the people cry to the Lord to get help and then turn to numbers chapter 20. And when you get to this chapter, Miriam has passed away and now they have no water.
And you're gonna love this U2. 'cause how fun is this? Miriam in Hebrew means water. And so she physically dies. Yeah. And then the children of Israel are without water. Isn't that kind of cool? That play right there? Yes. Mm-hmm. Wow. So this prophet and my, remember Miriam's a prophetess. So she dies and now there's no water for the congregation.
Does that mean Miriam and her prophecy, or does it mean literally no water? I think, you know, it could be both. Play on words. And so the children of Israel are so thirsty. Let's read verse three and four. Four Kimi. Sure. And the people ched with Moses and spa saying, would God that we had died when our brethren died before the Lord?
And why have you brought up the congregation of the Lord into this wilderness that we and our cattle should die there? Okay. Again, that's going back to, it was so much better in Egypt when we had garlic, like we had water in Egypt. Sure we were enslaved, but like, you know, so they're talking about that. So Aaron and Moses, they go from the presence of the assembly to the door of the tabernacle.
That's in verse six. And they fall upon their faces and the glory of the Lord appears to them. And verse seven, the Lord speak unto Moses saying, take the rod and gather thou the assembly together and air thy brother and speak ye unto the rock before their eyes and it shall give forth his water. And thou shalt bring forth to them water out of the rock.
So thou shalt give the congregation and their beasts drink. So that's what the Lord tells Moses to do. Here's how you're gonna give them water. We're gonna have this awesome miracle. And so sure enough, Moses and Aaron, they gather the congregation together in verse 10. And then they, here's what they say unto them, and we're gonna highlight what they say unto them.
And will you read that for me, Kimmi? Yes. And Moses and Aaron gathered the congregation together before the rock, and he said unto them, here, now ye rebels, must we fetch you water out of this rock? Now, I want you to circle something in there because they said, who's fetching the water out of the rock, according to verse 10.
What's the pronoun they use? We, we meaning Aaron and Moses? Mm-hmm. That's a problem. So then Moses lifts up his hand in verse 11. He SMOs the rock twice, water comes abundantly and the congregation drinks and their beast also. And then the Lord speaks to Moses and Aaron Farley. We read verse 12 and the Lord Spak unto Moses and Aaron, because you believed me not to sanctify me in the eyes of the children of Israel, therefore you shall not bring this congregation into the land, which I have given them.
He's saying, because you took the credit and didn't say the Lord, today would've been so easy for them to say, must we fetch you water out of this rock? Instead saying, the Lord will fetch you water out of this rock. The Lord is saying, yeah, you don't get to go to the Promised Land. And in this chapter in numbers.
Aaron will die. In verse 28, it says, Moses stripped Aaron of his garments and put them upon Azar. His son and Aaron died at the top of the Mount, and Moses and Azar came down from the mountain. So Aaron will die and not get to go into the wilderness and then turn to the very end of Deuteronomy.
Deuteronomy. The book of Deuteronomy is Moses' Last and final words to the children of Israel. It's his last hurrah. It's what he wants them to know before they enter in the promised land. They're standing right there on the cusp, on the edge of the wilderness about to enter the promised land. And then we are going to read in verse four, five and six, highlight those where it tells us that Moses will not enter the land.
He will not get to go to the promised land. He will be kept in the wilderness, and that's where he will die and be buried. Wow. God is a man of his word, isn't he? Yeah. Even after all Mo uh, Moses and Aaron, did they still have to follow the rules, right? Like, tell me how no respecter of persons then plays into this whole storyline and living in the wilderness.
Why do we want a God who's no respecter persons when you live in the wilderness? I don't know. But you would think that, I mean, you know, you would think that Moses and Aaron would have a little bit more leeway than someone else, and they don't Right? Well, and I'm just thinking about, this is right after Miriam dies, and so I'm thinking about their emotions.
Mm. And how they were probably sad and I mean, I'm sure they were, and, and Miriam brought a lot to, to the whole group so much that a few, a chapter back or two chapters back when she gets when leprosy. Yep. And they wait for her. To get over it, to keep moving. Like they completely stop the whole company and they, they wait, but she gets, you know, she gets hers, she gets leprosy because she doesn't honor the Lord, or I can't remember the whole story, but then they wait for it.
So it shows how important, I mean, they were, they were the trifecta, you know? Mm-hmm. For sure. They were the, they were the trifecta and one of them's gone. And I just wonder if they were thinking, I don't know, thinking straight, because it's interesting that he says in verse eight of numbers 20, speak ye onto the rock.
And then in verse 11, and Moses lifted up his hand and with the rod, he smo the rock twice. So it's a little bit different than what God really did ask him to do, I think. Yep. He did it on his own. He, he just made his own path. Yeah. And so from prophet to person, that whole gamut, the goal of the wilderness is for people to recognize who their God is.
Who is the Lord in their lives? Do they truly trust him? This 40 year time of test or trial is for everyone from prophet to person. It doesn't matter. And I love that for the Lord. He, he groups them all into one. In his world, nobody's better than the other person. 'cause again, I love how you said that Kimie, you would think that the Lord would say to Moses, I knew what you meant.
Hey, you know what? You've done so much good for me. And he can't, he's like, you have to learn the same lesson that I want everyone to learn. And I hope that they can see that in by what I'm doing with all of my people. And I think that that just goes well today in the world that we live in. Is are we looking to him?
I just had a thought about Jesus getting baptized. Yeah. Yes. Yeah. Fulfilled the commandment by doing that. Even though he was sinless, no respect or persons, he asked everyone to do the same thing. Wow. What a great lesson. Great wilderness lesson. So, yeah. Yeah. Okay. So good. All right, then here's the, we have another wilderness lesson.
So in the next segment we're gonna talk about an important lesson about snakes in the wilderness. And our good friend, Holly, this is for you. 'cause she's terrified of snakes. We'll do that. Next,
Segment 5
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we'd like to dedicate this segment to Holly Howard, who's terrified Yes. Won't go on hikes with us because she's so scared of snakes. All right. Farley, give us this story in the wilderness. Okay, so this story is in numbers chapter 21. In numbers chapter 21. They're still in the wilderness traveling and.
I'll be, dang, they're still complaining. What a shocker. Still complaining. Verse five. Wherefore, have you brought us up out of Egypt to die in the wilderness for there is no bread and neither is there any water. And our soul lo this, this light bread, stupid dumb man. We're still eating it. And so the Lord says, well, you know what?
I gotta teach you a lesson. So here's some fiery serpents, some fiery snakes. Not just normal snakes, but fiery snakes. Sounds pretty terrible. And they bit the people and tons of them die. End up dying from it. Yeah. Mm-hmm. And so they all come to Moses and they're crying and saying, we know we've sinned and we're complaining again.
And, and we've told the Lord that we can't stand it. So can you take these, can you pray that the Lord and take the, the snakes away? And so Moses prays for the people, and the Lord comes to Moses and said, here's what I want you to do. I want you to make a pole and make a, a, a snake on the pole. And then if everyone, whoever looks on that pole, the snake, they will live.
So it's so simple, right? Mm-hmm. You just have to look at the snake on the pole, and then you're gonna live from the bite. And that's, that's what happened. It's very, it's just a simple, simple thing. That's all you have to do. I had so many thoughts about this with the simplicity of what God asked us to do.
Mm-hmm. And it's tricky in, in our time because it does go back to that point that we were making with dissatisfaction about our lives and about our relationships and all of that. And can we just look to Jesus? Because in the end, it's a, it's a reference to Jesus on the cross. Mm-hmm. Is that right, Tam?
Yeah. Yes. It is. That it's, it's a reference of looking at Jesus and, and recognizing that he is the answer. And the other thing I love so much about this story is that God's judgment and his mercy are inseparable. So it's like two sides of one coin. Mm-hmm. So on the one side of the coin, you have the fiery serpents biting, and then on the other side of the coin you have the, the serpent saving.
The same thing. And of course I love the snake reference. And even today we see that, like on ambulances and whatever, you see that sign of the snake mm-hmm. On the pole and that it's healing, right? That's where it's from. Yeah. And, and you can see all of this through like snakes, venom, that the venom is used to poison and kill and it's also used to save.
There's like so many things. And so I just had a thought about, I love to, to think about polarities and finding this still point between polarities or like that middle point between the two sides of the coin. So, you know, common examples of polarities are like, love and fear, joy and sorrow, pleasure and pain, confidence and insecurity, humility and arrogance.
And in this case it is, you know, it's, it's his judgment and it's, and his mercy. Hmm. And, and that he gives the Israelites, both of them at the same time. Mm-hmm. And maybe if we can recognize that in those hard wilderness times that we're going through that, okay, yes, this is a hard time, but God's mercy is in this.
And even reading the Old Testament like that last, the story that Keem was talking about, of stoning, the guy there is mercy in that. The mercy comes from the fact that we know that God is gonna show up for us no matter what. You know? So I just think that there's a lot to learn from this paradox, from these polarities of both of it in this story.
And I love the fact that the snake is, is this evil symbol, and it's also this healing symbol that there's, there's both of them in the same case. Hmm. Ah, Kimi, what's the life lesson for you in the wilderness for this story? Well, I think that, I was just thinking, um, when Becky was talking about that, that, you know, sometimes the mercy for one person is in response is the justice.
And, and, and Becky was right. The justice of being held accountable for mistakes is how we're taught. And so, you know, as a parent, sometimes it's really hard to discipline our kids 'cause they're so cute and we love them. We don't wanna tell them no, but we have to override that and, and realize that we're, it's merciful to discipline a child because it'll save them further pain down the road and it will teach them, you know, in their life.
And so I love that. That's just such a great way to look at justice and mercy. It really goes hand in hand. Hmm. Wow. Kimmi, that's a great reminder for me when it comes to raising my youngest. Anyone raised the youngest, she barely, barely made it through. Right. That no word is real hard to say. 'cause you're just like, I'm tired.
I know, I know. Come on. I am a youngest. I am a youngest lady. Case in point right there, you're the poster child. Try trying to say no to Becky. You heard. Exactly. But I think you're absolutely right. And so the Lord, I That's a great application for that. And it's interesting too because then sometimes when I've noticed with my youngest, I enable her too much that I'm just like, the answer's so easy.
Why can't you figure it out? Oh, 'cause I've done it for you. Oh, okay. Sorry. That's that's on me. Yeah. Like, I'm not making her learn the hard way. And so you, you have these children of Israel and then you have the scripture references in two Nephi and Alma and Heliman that are like many perished because it was so easy.
They couldn't, they couldn't believe it. They're like, no, that's, there's no way many perish because of the easiness of the way. And so I think, how many times is that me? Like really? It's that easy? Seems like there's gotta be more to it. So, no, it really is. If we go back to the, the guy collecting sticks on the Sabbath, you know, we don't, we did not like that.
Yeah. It doesn't feel good, but it, you know, it's part of, there, there's a lot to it. Also, when we talk about disciplining our kids, our kids don't understand, they don't have the knowledge that we have. Right. So they don't like it, but we understand why we have to do it. And it's the same in that situation.
Like, there's stuff we don't understand about why God would do that, why he would, you know, cause a man to be stoned to death for collecting sticks. Um, it, there's a bigger picture. We don't always see the bigger picture. Yeah. And that's where trust comes in. Yep. For sure. There's a bigger picture I love that.
We, we don't, we don't understand. And that's where we have to just be patient and trust faith and, yep. Very good answers. Awesome. Okay, so then let's take this concept then there is a bigger picture we don't understand, and we're gonna apply it in the next segment to some lessons and stories about laws in the wilderness.
We'll do that next.
Segment 6
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Okay, I get to tell this story and I am so excited 'cause it's one of my favorite Old Testament stories that often get skipped over. We are not skipping it. We are gonna focus on it, spend some time in it. Turn to numbers chapter 27. 'cause this story has to do 100% totally with women who I think maybe saw the bigger picture and they went for it.
They're so brave. Uh, like when we talk, I know we always talk about standing in someone's line in the up in heaven meeting all the famous scripture people, I'm standing in their line. I wanna stand in the line of the daughters of Z Loha and meet every one of these sisters. I can't wait to meet 'em by name here.
Or their names in numbers Chapter 27 verse one. Their names are Maah, Noah, Hola, milkha, and. Ladies, hello. Okay, here's the story. So what you wanna know is there's a man by the name of Zalo Fahad, and he only has daughters, no sons at all. And this is a problem because when the father dies, everything he owns only goes to male heirs.
So if he doesn't have sons, then everything's gonna go to his brothers or his nephews or anybody. That's a man. And the, I love that the daughters are not having it. They're super upset about this. And so they say in verse three, let's go ahead and read this and will you read it for us Farley? Our father died in the wilderness and he was not in the company of them that gathered themselves together against the Lord in the company of Cora, but died in his own sin and had no sons.
Now the story of that where he says, they say that he's not part of the company of Cora, that's in numbers chapter 16 verses one through four. There was this naughty group of people and they got in trouble, and so they're saying our dad wasn't a part of that group, like he died in his own sense. He's a good man.
But the interesting thing is where they're saying these words, look at verse two, because in verse two it says they stood before Moses and before Eleazar are the priest and before the princes and all the congregation by the door of the tabernacle of the congregation just right there. What does that tell you about these women who are going and speaking to the prophet, to the priest at the tabernacle?
What does that tell you about them? They're confident. Yeah. So confident. Absolutely. So brave. The audacity of these women to think that they can go and just talk to the prophet and tell them the problem that they have. They're not following the proper channels of the 70 that have been set up or going through a ma, a male error or anything.
They go straight to the source. And then verse four, keep reading for us, Farley, why should the name of our father be done away from among his family? Because he hacked no son. Give unto us, therefore a possession among the brethren of our father. Okay, now, Kimi, read verse five. And after you do tell me what we know or what we now believe about Moses in this verse.
And Moses brought their cause before the Lord. What does that one verse teach us about this man that he has? He has mercy and love for the women and respects them enough to go to the Lord. Oh, absolutely. Now remember, and I love that you brought this up, Becky, thinking about his heart at the time that that happened with his brother, like his sister had died.
Now his brother Aaron is gone and Moses has to deal with all of these complainers. It would've been well within his right to just be like, I am done. Like call another prophet. I wonder if he ever had a tantrum with the Lord. I'd love to know if he did have a prayer. Like, please send somebody else. Yeah, he did earlier in this book.
Didn't he say are these are, did I birth all these children? How come I have to all these people? Yeah, you're totally right. 11. I think he said that in 11. Did I birth them all? No. So now we are at this point where he's just like, all right, here we go again. And now we have women who are complaining to me and he could have so easily turned them away and said, you don't have a place here.
You don't have a right to come up and talk to me. The law is the law. 'cause this is the law of Moses. The Lord set this in stone, like this is the way it is, the men inherit. That's how we do things. And so he goes to the Lord and he brings this problem. I just love that, that moment. 'cause he could have just stopped him in their tracks and said, sorry ladies, we don't change the rules.
But he didn't. So then he goes, and let's read the Lord's response, verse seven and eight and Kimi, will you read that for us? Yes. But first can I say sometimes that's why it's really good to have women's perspectives. 'cause sometimes they'll say that's, why do we have that rule? It's kind of dumb. That's how we get a lot of things changed.
Okay, I love it. Verse seven. The daughters of sofa had speak right. Thou shalt surely give them a possession of an inheritance among their father's brethren. And thou shalt cause the inheritance of their father to pass on to them. And verse eight. Thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel saying, if a man die and have no son, then you shall cause his inheritance to pass unto his daughter.
I'm sorry. Right there. Law is changed because these five women stood before Moses and said, Hey, we gotta fix this. It's not working. Yeah. This isn't working. And a sweet, humble prophet says, let me see what the Lord has to say. Oh, love that lesson in the wilderness. And I love how you said Kimi. Sometimes you just have to listen.
Sometimes you just have to listen to what have a different perspective. Mm-hmm. So taking all of this that we've studied today, and we're gonna read the one more part of Rabbi Stephen Kushner's quote on the wilderness. And I think this is so cool because we talk about being in the wilderness. We've just studied all of these examples of experiences in the wilderness.
And then here's what Rabbi Kushner has lastly to say, and Becky, will you read this, please? Yeah. We focus so much on the things with which we struggle. We direct so much of our attention onto our hopes and dreams. Yet the place wherein we eat and sleep and argue and love the day-to-day journeys that move us from and to, and sometimes back again, the ordinary landscape of life somehow gets overshadowed.
But well, we know it is the most important part. Just jump in and share your thoughts. Well, just for me, going back to how easily we become dis dissatisfied with the ordinary and the ordinary is what heals us. Yeah. It's in the ordinary that we find relief and, and solid ground to stand on. And there is, I mean, there's studies that talk about when you take a walk in the same, like the same walk over and over, how it actually does bring peace and relief from seeing the same tree from season to season, from seeing the same patch of grass or neighbors, the, you know, whatever it may be, that that actually brings like a sense of, of um, calm and a sense of relief of, okay, everything is, is all right in the world.
And I think that that goes along with like just doing what's in front of you. Mm-hmm. Whether it's the dishes or the laundry or whatever. But those are the things that we become so dissatisfied with so quickly. Yeah. And so that's the most important part. Yeah. That's the of that stuff, most important part.
Yeah. Happiness really lies in, in the ordinary. Mm-hmm. It doesn't lie in the things that we think are gonna bring us happiness, that we lust after that we, that we think we need more, more, more. It's, you know, when we can learn to appreciate just our ordinary life and the things that are in front of us and around us.
Yeah. That's happiness and peace. Oh, I absolutely agree Kimmi. I like that. Well, and let's read this last scripture that talks to us about what the Lord will do with our ordinary. It's Isaiah chapter 51, verse three. So go all the way back to where we started. Let's go to the book of numbers, and we're gonna put this Isaiah scripture right next to the word numbers.
That's where I have it, just to remind me that what I'm about to read in the book of numbers, here's what the Lord does with our ordinary wilderness. Isaiah chapter 51, verse three, and Kimi, will you read that for me? Hmm. The Lord shall comfort Zion. He will comfort all her waste places, and he will make her wilderness like Eden and her Deseret like the garden of the Lord.
Joy and gladness shall be found therein. Thanksgiving and the voice of melody, there it is. Everything you guys just summed up. Happiness is in the ordinary and the Lord makes our ordinary like Eden, a garden of joy and gladness. That's pretty awesome. Mm-hmm. I love that. I love that so much. Why do you love it, Farley?
Well, I'm just thinking about my own wilderness experiences and when I finally directed my attention to Heavenly Father and Jesus and prayed and said, I have a problem. Mm-hmm. And then it feels like that's the instant. Healing that occurs is that comfort The instant, like, it's okay, you got this, you, you can do this.
It's hard, but you can do this, and that can happen in any wilderness experience, no matter how difficult it is. I feel like that comfort, the Lord shall comfort Becky. He's gonna comfort all her waste places and make her wilderness like Eden. It's gonna, it's gonna feel easier just by knowing that he's there and he is gonna provide whatever it is.
I love how I replace Zion with Becky. That's perfect. Put your name right there. Well, thank you ladies. That's the end of our discussion. We're done. Woohoo. You can breathe. Kemi, you did it. Are we still friends? Yay. Absolutely. Okay. Gather your thoughts and look over everything that you marked in your scriptures or notes that you took, and just quickly share with us a quick little takeaway, or what eternal truth did you learn from our discussion today about the book of numbers or in the wilderness?
Well, I, it's always good to be reminded, to be grateful for what we have, and so that was, that was great. Just from studying and, and recording the podcast, it's just good to have that reminder and, you know, thanks to the Holy Ghost, that's been reminding me all week to stop complaining. But the thing that stood out to me, I think the most was the connection to remember that connection between justice and mercy.
That, that they really are hand in hand and mm-hmm. That justice is, you know, we can be grateful for it if we see it as mercy. I like that. It's a great one. Thank you, Kimi. Mm-hmm. What about you, Beck? I have never, uh, for whatever reason, I feel like you should have end of wilderness, right? You should, like, wilderness should end sometime in our life.
So to know that, you know what, it's just not gonna, it's, it's here, but that you can find that God will comfort us mm-hmm. During it. But that it's okay to be confused. It's okay to wander and God is still there in all of the details. And also, you know, like King said, you know, justice and mercy are, are connected and I hope that I don't wander for 40 years when I could just wander for 11 days.
Yeah. I really hope that I can, you know, wake up quick enough. And I, I would never ever say that. I'm not gonna complain. 'cause of course I will continue to complain. It's it, but maybe wake up to God's love and mercy and, and his plan a little bit sooner than what I've done in the past. Well, that's a great connection.
Yeah, thanks. Be mine. Were Becky. I love so much at the beginning when you're like, God loves a complainer. I mean you think of that. He does. He so patient with us. But I loved our discussion about the word lusting and how you, like all of us, even me, have always thought it meant sexual stuff. But then you thought, I love how you compared it to social media and how everything around us has us lusting after all the stuff we don't think we have.
So that was such a great discussion and it just, it was a paradigm shift for me on, on the word lusting and how easily I do it. Absolutely. And then Kimi, I totally loved your experience where you talked about your trust era and how, I just love that where you, 'cause all of us have been there where we've spent time really questioning and wondering and then I love how now you're just in your trust era.
'cause I think that might be the safest era to be in. But I love your experience that you learned, so thank you for being vulnerable and sharing that. That was very cool. So thanks. Okay. Love you guys, love ya Tam. We're done. Love you too. love you. That was fun. Okay, tell me what eternal truth you learned. What did you learn from this discussion?
Go join our group on Facebook or follow us on Instagram to share what you have learned. And then sometimes we post a question that relates to this episode, so share your comment that relate to that. You can get to both our Facebook and Instagram by going to the show notes for this episode at ldsliving.com slash Sunday on Monday and go there anyway, because it's where we will have links to all the references and a transcript of this whole discussion.
So go check it out. The Sunday on Monday Study Group is a Deseret Bookshelf Plus original, brought to you by LDS Living. It's written and hosted by me, Tammy Uzelac Hall. And today our Superb Study Group participants were Kimi Farley and Becky Farley. And you can find more information about my friends at ldsliving.com slash Sunday on Monday.
Our podcast is produced by Cole Wissinger and me. It is edited and mixed by Cole Wissinger, and our executive producer is Erin Hallstrom. Thanks for being here. We'll see you next week. And please remember that even in the wilderness, you really are God's favorite.
SOM Transcript - S7E2
Season 7 Ep. 2 | Sunday on Monday
The following transcript is intended to aid in your study. However, while we try to go through the transcript, our transcripts are primarily computer-generated and often contain errors. Please forgive the transcripts’ imperfections.
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